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 Post subject: Re: #184 Boidhre vs Tomukaze
Post #201 Posted: Fri Jun 21, 2013 6:40 pm 
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It's nice that boidhre sees the loose ladder shape, but I don't think there is one there.

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 Post subject: Re: #184 Boidhre vs Tomukaze
Post #202 Posted: Fri Jun 21, 2013 6:47 pm 
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Yeah, I also don't see how to capture L13:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . 4 O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O 2 3 O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X . 1 . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . . . . O . O . . |[/go]
That said, he can use this to get some moves in sente, which might help him get another eye.

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 Post subject: Re: #184 Boidhre vs Tomukaze
Post #203 Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:29 am 
Lives with ko
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Posts: 204
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Rank: KGS 3 Kyu
KGS: seanachain
DGS: seanachain
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm108 Prisoners: :b1: :w5:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . O . O O . . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . 1 . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . 2 . O . , O . . |
$$ | . . X X . . O . . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Next I'll aim for a move around a, and induce moves in the b area. I'm sure he'll see this though. So let's see his response and then I'll decide what to do.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm108 Prisoners: :b1: :w5:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . O . O O . . . . . b . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . a . 1 . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . 2 . O . , O . . |
$$ | . . X X . . O . . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #184 Boidhre vs Tomukaze
Post #204 Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:35 am 
Oza

Posts: 2493
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Universal go server handle: skydyr
Online playing schedule: When my wife is out.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . O . O O . . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . 1 . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . 2 . O . , O . . |
$$ | . . X X . . O . . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


As black, this exchange would make me cry.

I'm inclined to think that black could have invaded first and made a second eye on the right or ran to connect once the miai was taken.

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 Post subject: Re: #184 Boidhre vs Tomukaze
Post #205 Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:46 am 
Lives in sente

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The Intrepid wrote:
Yeah, I also don't see how to capture L13:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . 4 O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O 2 3 O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X . 1 . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . . . . O . O . . |[/go]
That said, he can use this to get some moves in sente, which might help him get another eye.

Black can actually use the threat to capture L13 to safely connect his group with no additional help. Certain moves in the center will also turn this sequence into an outright capture of L13. This makes black hard to attack.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Black 11 at ''a''
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X 0 X O 1 . O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . 8 X 2 7 . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . 6 4 3 . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X 9 5 a . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . O . O O . . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . O . , O . . |
$$ | . . X X . . O . . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Last edited by lightvector on Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

This post by lightvector was liked by: The Intrepid
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 Post subject: Re: #184 Boidhre vs Tomukaze
Post #206 Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:59 am 
Oza

Posts: 2356
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Universal go server handle: Boidhre
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm108 Prisoners: :b1: :w5:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O 3 . O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . O . O O . . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . 1 . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . 2 . O . , O . . |
$$ | . . X X . . O . . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


No guts, no glory I suppose. My right hand group is weak right now but I think I can survive an attack there. I'll be honest, for the past three weeks I've been living 48+ hour days, yesterday I was awake for 38 hours and really I'm not feeling in the best of it today so I'm bound to make mistakes but this is fun so I'll keep doing it.

The idea is how he responds after:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm108 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O 3 . O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X 4 . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . 5 . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . O . O O . . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . 1 . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . 2 . O . , O . . |
$$ | . . X X . . O . . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I don't see a way for the two white stones to live, though I may have missed something. This means my biggest liability on the board is taken care of and some pressure is put on White on the right. With :b8: I think I've enough options on the right to do this. Maybe not though. Eh, we'll see how Tom responds.

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 Post subject: Re: #184 Boidhre vs Tomukaze
Post #207 Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 5:09 am 
Lives with ko
User avatar

Posts: 204
Liked others: 26
Was liked: 27
Rank: KGS 3 Kyu
KGS: seanachain
DGS: seanachain
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm108 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O 3 . O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . 4 . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . O . O O . . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . 1 . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . 2 . O . , O . . |
$$ | . . X X . . O . . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


What now Mr.Black!? :twisted:

Possible continuation....

Now my centre group is ok, I'm solidifying the bottom and :w17: in the diagram below extends help to my future possible weak group on the left. I feel I am ahead now, even though I haven't counted. His ponuki capture isn't worth that much, I don't think his J10 group was in much danger to be honest and it would be silly for me to attack it as what points would I gain from the attack!?? I feel this way is better, threaten to pull out L13 whilst making my weak right group stronger. I have a feeling that he will have to come back at a as well, in that case I'll play something like b to split his corner group off whilst lending a hand to my right side group.



Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm108 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O 3 . O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X 5 . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . 4 . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . O . O O . . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . a . 6 . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . X . b . . . . 9 7 . 1 . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 0 8 . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . 2 . O . , O . . |
$$ | . . X X . . O . . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

_________________
我が道を行く。
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 Post subject: Re: #184 Boidhre vs Tomukaze
Post #208 Posted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 7:21 pm 
Oza

Posts: 2356
Location: Ireland
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Universal go server handle: Boidhre
Sorry Tom, real life has been crap for a while.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm108 Prisoners: :b1: :w5:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . O X . . . . O . X . O O X . |
$$ | . O O . O O . . X . X . O . X . X . . |
$$ | . X O O . X X X O X . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . X O O O O O O O . X . X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X X O . X O O X . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . X X X O . O X . X O 3 . O X O . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . X . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X X . . . . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O X O X . X , . 4 . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . O . O O . . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . 1 . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . 2 . O . , O . . |
$$ | . . X X . . O . . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This move might be a mistake but this may be the biggest, or at least one of the biggest, moves for me on the board right now. If he pulls out that stone I don't mind. I think I can live on the right-hand side. I'm losing I think but I didn't want to complicate with all the aji and forcing moves in the bottom left corner. This might be a mistake.

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