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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #21 Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 4:49 pm 
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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . B . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #22 Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 6:48 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . W X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Well, I'm not so sure about this, but...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . a . . B O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . b . . B B O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Ideally, I'd like to attack the marked group somehow. So I first considered a or b. But of course I'm a little surrounded on the top myself, and:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 8 5 . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . 4 O 7 3 1 . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 6 . 2 . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . a . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

This looks a little dodgy for me. I'd like to split with a as soon as possible (preferably at :w9:), but it gives me more or less no eyeshape on the top. If I use :w9: to sort out the cuts in the top left, black can probably just tenuki and play somewhere around a himself, threatening to seal me in and connect. This looks playable, perhaps, but I'd be giving myself a weak group while attacking black, and giving black the corner; I'm not so daring to think this is a good idea today.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 7 . . . 0 a . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O 4 2 8 9 . B O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 6 5 3 1 b . B B O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

:w1: looks good, but whereas the placement at :b2: would normally just die, here it can connect up and eat my corner because the marked group is giving shortage of liberties. Usually white could double hane at a and black b wouldn't work, but here white doesn't have enough liberties for it.

It's worth noticing this weakness:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . T . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


Black's corner becomes unhappy very quickly if I play there. I'd like to deal with the upper left quickly (and 'violently', so that black can't take sente to play on the upper right first). So on reflection I'm going to choose to attach underneath black's approach stone:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . 5 . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . 3 , . . . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . 1 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 2 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 6 , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

I don't mind this variation at all. Black settles on the left hand side, but I have solid territory in the corner and sente.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 6 5 8 . . . . W O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 O 4 . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . 3 2 . 0 . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . 1 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Black may choose to play an avalanchey variation. If so, that's my attacking over; but I have sente, and black is overconcentrated at the top, making very few points because of :w9: and the marked stone, without much potential for development. Meanwhile, I've built the left-hand side and kept most of the corner, and it's hard for black to squash me down.

As far as I know, black can't just cut and take the corner without becoming very weak on the outside, conceding me lots of influence towards the left and top sides. I await correction, though...

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #23 Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 4:37 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . B . . . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #24 Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:07 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . W X . . . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #25 Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:17 pm 
Lives in sente

Posts: 1161
Location: VA, USA
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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O B . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #26 Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 7:38 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . W O X . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Decided to go for this variation instead. Black has a cut and still not really a base. Black should probably defend, and if he does I'll go do something fun elsewhere.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #27 Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 11:14 pm 
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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . B . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Post #28 Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:09 am 
Honinbo
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For beginners. :b1: is a very big shared local vital point -- one variation:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ -------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O O X . . . .
$$ | . . O X . 3 . . .
$$ | . . O X . . . . .
$$ | . . . 1 . . . . .
$$ | . . 2 . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . , . . . . .[/go]
Otherwise, W can take :w1: himself, followed by the double hane :w3::
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ -------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O O X . . . .
$$ | . . O X . B . . .
$$ | . . O X . . . . .
$$ | . . . 1 2 . . . .
$$ | . . . . 3 . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . , . . . . .[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #29 Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 7:41 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . W . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Well, I was looking for something annoying to do in the upper right, but after all it's probably best just to leave it and finish prodding at black's shape. If I retain sente, I think I'm doing well. I expect this sort of thing:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . a . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O 1 3 . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . b . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . c . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


and suddenly it's hard to see where black's points are coming from - black hopefully won't get much on top because of a (gote for both sides I think, but pretty big), and the right-hand side is still a little thin. My left-hand side is wide open, and I should think of playing b at some point. It's slightly weird direction, though, but if I play c the left is still very open. Tricky, tricky.

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Post #30 Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:02 pm 
Honinbo
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For beginners. In billywoods's var, :w4: is timid:
billywoods wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O 1 3 . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
W can continue to push with :wc: in sente:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #31 Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 12:14 am 
Lives in sente

Posts: 1161
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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X B . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Fascinating. This probably wasn't ideal but c'est la vie. Nevertheless, maybe I'll get sente out of this and form a fabulous right side. Then I can use that fabulosity to forge an even more fantastic center.

But maybe I'm getting ahead of myself. My goal is to not play stupid moves. Likely I will do exactly that without realizing it, but we shall see!

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #32 Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 6:34 pm 
Lives in gote

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Universal go server handle: billywoods
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Don't know what to do in the upper left. I'll come back to it.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #33 Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 7:30 pm 
Lives in sente

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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . B . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

My gut feeling is that I still have something to gain at the top. But this is more important. And I'll probably target the left side if I can get sente out of this. My right side looks good, but I can diminish the left side for :white: if I play intelligently ( :roll: ).

I'm also keen on seeing how the center ends out considering how the top right ended up. Never seen that situation before so I kind of had to go with the flow there.

Sehr interessant! :D

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #34 Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:00 am 
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Both are missing that white's top group is really weak. So is black upper right corner. Black O18 is continuation of the joseki, white would probably respond and than black can make territory and attack white at the same time. But white can solve his issues by attacking the corner now. Curious who sees this first :-)

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #35 Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 2:51 am 
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Sur wrote:
Both are missing that white's top group is really weak. So is black upper right corner. Black O18 is continuation of the joseki, white would probably respond and than black can make territory and attack white at the same time. But white can solve his issues by attacking the corner now. Curious who sees this first :-)
Agreed, urgent before big. At first I wanted white to play R14, but then he has two groups. Instead, white Q17 looks very nice. Do you tenuki now to do it, or do you first, just play R3, and expect to gain sente?

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #36 Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 2:57 am 
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billywoods wrote:
By the way (for the observers): this game is open book, which hopefully means we'll both learn something...
Does "open book" mean you can read the comments, even the closed ones? If so, is it bad form for viewers to make suggestions before plays? If so, I apologize for my bad form in the previous comment.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #37 Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 5:49 am 
Judan

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wineandgolover wrote:
billywoods wrote:
By the way (for the observers): this game is open book, which hopefully means we'll both learn something...
Does "open book" mean you can read the comments, even the closed ones? If so, is it bad form for viewers to make suggestions before plays? If so, I apologize for my bad form in the previous comment.


No, it means the players can look in joseki dictionaries, pro games, other books etc. to help them play.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #38 Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:12 am 
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wineandgolover wrote:
billywoods wrote:
By the way (for the observers): this game is open book, which hopefully means we'll both learn something...
Does "open book" mean you can read the comments, even the closed ones? If so, is it bad form for viewers to make suggestions before plays? If so, I apologize for my bad form in the previous comment.

No, as Uberdude said - I'm not reading the comments!

I'm curious to see what people are saying, and whether or not it matches up to what I'm thinking. This is the part of the game I feel weakest at. I suppose I might as well throw my whole-board feelings out there at the moment:

help what's going on help I don't understand help help

I really have trouble judging what's biggest on a board like this. I've been controlling the flow of the game for a while but don't really feel like I've managed to do anything globally useful with it. I was happy with the upper-right result because I think I'm quite strong there and black is quite weak, but as soon as black spends another stone there my fun is over. Still, if I jump in at R14 or Q14 or so I get split and probably everything in that area turns into a horrible 2-point group. Is that good? I don't know. I could also jump, but is that sente? Is it big? It looks like it might just strengthen black. Who knows. The upper left is nice for me - but black's shape looks a little too strong now and anything I do there now will be gote (and not that big since the left side is very open). So I approached a corner. Because... corners before sides before centre? And my first thoughts on this pincer are to jump into the corner: black will block from 'above', I'll get sente, the lower side will become uninteresting, and I get to flatten the upper-right corner somehow. Maybe. But then black still gets a big lump of territory, and the left is still open, and I don't really seem to have a coherent plan here.

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Post #39 Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 2:30 am 
Honinbo
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billywoods,
billywoods wrote:
I really have trouble judging what's biggest on a board like this.
I understand how you feel. :)

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Post #40 Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:39 am 
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Ed:

Yes - I imagine getting over this stage is the necessary hurdle to take me from 4k to about 7d. ;)

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