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Offline Splatted
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #141 Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 5:46 pm 
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Edit: I'll re-post the move since I started a new page.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm21 :b6: :w3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 0 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I didn't feel the need to comment before because Joaz's correction makes sense to me. I didn't think he'd let skydyr's move stand, and the move he chose instead has obvious value.

I decided that my previous plan of pushing down on black would be aji keshi, but I still wanted to strengthen my two stones on the top so I decided to play a one point jump at K15. I was tempted to play something on the other side (N15?) to try and link up with P12 but it felt overconcentrated to have all my stones on the right side and the directions seems wrong. This way my strength is facing out towards black's stones and my weakness is protected by white stones.
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Offline skydyr
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #142 Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 7:12 am 
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In retrospect, I like Joaz's move. Mine was not really an attack white had to respond to, and I don't think it was necessary for the stability of the corner. This jump may look loose, but black can sacrifice that one stone to maintain a strong presence in the center and severely limit any of white's potential there.

This post by skydyr was liked by: Joaz Banbeck
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Offline TIM82
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #143 Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 1:26 pm 
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Approved.
But really, wouldn't direct n15 been better than the sequence of last three moves? Why did you want to exchange p12 for o6 first?

I don't like this kind of leisure one space jumps all around the board, would prefer something more sharp and active, but guess that's just style issue, not important enough for a change. And in any case I can't quarantee good results from moves I have considered - I quess I'm too unfamiliar with these kind of situations... In any case, strenghtening the two stone seems like it can open up all kind of possibilities in both adjacent corners.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm21 :b6: :w3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 0 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Offline Joaz Banbeck
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #144 Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 3:28 pm 
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I think that the obvious and simple response at H15 looks good for us. White gets a safer group with modest territorial prospects, while we get about 20 points of almost secure territory.

I'll be surprised if younger brother does not play it.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline skydyr
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #145 Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 6:24 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 :b6: :w3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . 1 . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

This seems like an easy solidifying move. I've been thinking of a one space jump up from black's last move as well, but I don't think I'd get enough out of an exchange of the right for top left to make it sente.
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Offline Joaz Banbeck
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #146 Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 8:11 am 
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I wholeheartedly approve.
:tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup:

The exchange of K15 for H15 is a net profit for us. And it is more than three points, IMO. I'm surprised that opposing elder brother approved K15.

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Offline schultz
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #147 Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 11:02 am 
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Joaz Banbeck wrote:
I wholeheartedly approve.
:tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup: :tmbup:

The exchange of K15 for H15 is a net profit for us. And it is more than three points, IMO. I'm surprised that opposing elder brother approved K15.


For Joaz:
Thanks for these sorts of comments! It adds a lot of depth to these games to see what you're thinking in relation to your own little brothers play, and especially with the approvals (or not) from your opponent!

Specific question about the previous (opponents) move. Where would you have preferred to play? K15 looks like a decent move to me for supporting the two white stones on top, and giving options against both corners. Maybe N15 better? Something more sharp?

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Offline Joaz Banbeck
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #148 Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 12:44 pm 
Judan
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schultz wrote:
...
... Where would you have preferred to play? K15 looks like a decent move to me for supporting the two white stones on top, and giving options against both corners. Maybe N15 better? Something more sharp?


K15 doesn't really have much effect on both corners. It certainly makes an invasion of the upper left much easier, but it doesn't really affect the upper right.

If I were playing white, and were determined to do something up top, I would have done something like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


It threatens this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . C . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


...which not only takes most of the right side but now threatens an invasion in the upper right.
Then if black responds like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 3 . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

...white invades the upper left.

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Offline Splatted
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #149 Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 5:16 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 :b6: :w3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . 2 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Seems like a good way of limiting black's potential on the bottom while also building up mine on the side. If I can build a wall in sente I'll probably play E10. If black replies to that with E12 I think the exchange will have been good for white.
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Offline skydyr
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #150 Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 6:55 am 
Oza

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Assuming this gets approved, I think black is pretty happy to defend on the third line. White is trying to get a bigger center since he is behind on points, but I don't think that this can be easily accomplished. Black has support on three sides and trying to build on the top will also help black build his moyo into territory.
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Offline Joaz Banbeck
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #151 Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:10 am 
Judan
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skydyr wrote:
... I think black is pretty happy to defend on the third line. ...


Defend? DEFEND?? This move is an overplay. Defending against it is giving it way more credit than it deserves. :grumpy:
We must push through.

If they want to engage in a pushing fight, I think that this is one of those rare occasions in which pushing from behind may be good for us.

This looks good:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc :b6: :w3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 3 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . 2 1 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

...as does this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc :b6: :w3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . 5 6 . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . 2 1 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

...and this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc :b6: :w3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 7 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . 6 5 . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . 2 1 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline Splatted
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #152 Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:59 am 
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Thank god Joaz didn't like skydyr's post again. That really freaked me out before. :D

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Offline TIM82
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #153 Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 12:55 pm 
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Disapproved. :tmbdown:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32 :b6: :w6:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I may be missing something obvious (renovating in large scale makes one very tired indeed...), but what on earth white is going to do after 33 below??? :scratch: Since Splatted gave no clear plan of response to this most natural line, can't do anything but disapprove.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32 :b6: :w3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . 2 1 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


The top left area seems most important, if black gets to play C below the position is too good by far and the white position on left seems even shabbier than now. I considered something like A or B but they seem too easy to respond. So let's try this first as it offers support to invasions at both D and E, and seems not trivial to answer, before deciding on course of action in corner. Not sure about my move. Apologies in advance, Splatted, if I messed it up...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32 :b6: :w6:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . a b . d . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . e . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . c . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

This post by TIM82 was liked by: Joaz Banbeck
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Offline Joaz Banbeck
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #154 Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 1:08 pm 
Judan
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I don't see that the new move is any better than the old one. ( Maybe there is some fancy invasion of our upper left that works because of that placement, but I don't see it. ) It has the same defect as the previous move: it is an overplay, and will probably become a target. If we get a three stone dowry with this move, I like it.

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Offline skydyr
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #155 Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2013 7:10 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32 :b6: :w6:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . 2 . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32 :b6: :w6:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . a . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . 2 . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , b . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . b . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . b . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

This correction makes sense for white to me. White needs to do something about black's growing potential there and the other option didn't seem particularly effective, as I mentioned earlier. I am playing :b33: because it makes miai of enclosing at A and causing damage at one of the B points. With a bit of luck, I can cause a lot of damage to white's other groups in the process of chasing out :w32:.

I thought for a while about alternatives, but couldn't really come up with anything good.
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Offline Joaz Banbeck
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #156 Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2013 9:41 am 
Judan
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I approve. :clap:

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Offline Splatted
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #157 Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2013 11:33 am 
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I'll post more later.

I've been pretty quiet because I'm not sure what I think about this move. On the one hand, I can see Tim's point that I was being way too nice in letting black just wall off that area, but on the other... wtf do I do now? :-?

Clearly this stone can escape, but I'm a little worried about the price of doing so since both my nearby groups have significant weaknesses. I'm tempted to try and sacrifice with something like:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 The marked stones are 11 12 and 13
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . B W W . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 0 7 X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . 8 5 9 , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . 6 X 3 O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O 4 1 2 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This makes my top group nice and strong, but I wonder if it gives away too much? At the end of that sequence the F14 stone still has a lot of aji, so let's assume black uses his sente to play H13 and capture :w1: : now he has about 35 points of pretty solid territory and strong central influence, so I'm going to have to rule out this sequence.
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Offline Splatted
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #158 Posted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 9:55 am 
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Sorry for the slowness. I've been really busy recently and haven't had the energy to think about this move properly, but I'm free tomorrow and will definitely make a move then if I don't tonight.

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Offline Splatted
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #159 Posted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:04 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32 :b6: :w6:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X 3 . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I thought about this a lot and I decided I don't like running out with this stone, since black gets to build influence chasing it and it doesn't actually do that much to reduce his territory.

Instead I decided to try and go deeper, and depending on how it goes I'm aiming for the cut at a, splitting off and attacking the two marked stones, or invading the corner.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32 :b6: :w6:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X 3 . a . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . B . B . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Here's what seems like the most likely continuation:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 :b6: :w6:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 1 3 X a O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X O 2 8 9 0 . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . 5 4 . . X a O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 6 . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


White plays whichever a black doesn;t play, and then it's a fight between two weak groups.
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Offline illluck
 Post subject: Re: Big Brother Malkovich #5
Post #160 Posted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 3:28 pm 
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Presumably it wouldn't go that way - there's a threw-in to capture. That sequence is very short on liberties anyways.

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Board index » L19²GO (Malkovich) » Big Brother Malkovich games

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