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 Post subject: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #1 Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 10:58 am 
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Even game, japanese rules. Closed book. 6.5 pt komi.

Nigiri:

:white: :white: :white: :white:


Last edited by otenki on Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #2 Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:37 am 
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even

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #3 Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:38 am 
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Indeed its even so you can choose.

Cheers,
Otenki

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #4 Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:40 am 
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I'll take black


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c This is a label for the diagram.
$$ ---------------------------------------
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$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Good luck and have fun :]

been practicing 3-4

I hope to end up with this.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c This is a label for the diagram.
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #5 Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:16 am 
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Enjoy the game !!!

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Observers:
Not that much of strategy yet.

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #6 Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:24 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


how unfortunate

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


i want this to happen

but i think white will pincer.

and i hate doing this

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


and now i don't want to dive into the corner because i don't think i want white having a wall facing my komoku

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #7 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:26 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Observers:
Let's play unconventional in order to set him off balance :-) I hope to do some kind of fighting joseki. If not I want sente :-)

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #8 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:03 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . |
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$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Hey otenki welcome back. Hope everything is okay.
foiled again!

no reason to complicate
if i end in sente i get the open corner

if he gets to the corner first it's as if we played a normal opening.

hopefully he plays a 4-4 in the open corner because i feel more comfortable approaching those.

but he has no reason to go for the last corner since this joseki ends favorable for his 4-4 stone

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #9 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:33 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . 4 6 1 . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Observers:
Avalanche:rambo:

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #10 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 12:17 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 7 . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . 4 6 1 . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


aw man this is what i'm afraid of. something with lots of variations and no joseki book to lean back on.
i have a feeling i'm going to make a mistake early here and then the whole game will fall apart.

i've heard horror stories about this joseki spanning across the board hopefully i can find a way to make this easier even if it costs me very bad local result.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 5 7 . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . 4 6 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

this is my next move.

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #11 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:10 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 7 . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . 4 6 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Observers:
Only move for white.

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #12 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:23 pm 
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Posts: 447
Liked others: 137
Was liked: 68
Rank: kgs 5kyu
KGS: Unusedname
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 5 7 . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . 4 6 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


after this i'll probably get lost. I've seen enough sgfs with this joseki that i might recognize a few patterns but right now it's just about extending and not getting hit on the head.

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #13 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:26 pm 
Gosei

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Alternatively, Black could opt to play the Small Avalanche instead (see below), but it's still complicated.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 7 . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . 9 4 6 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . |
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$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #14 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:28 pm 
Lives in gote
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Posts: 415
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 5 7 . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . 0 4 6 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #15 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:32 pm 
Oza

Posts: 2493
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Online playing schedule: When my wife is out.
Marcus wrote:
Alternatively, Black could opt to play the Small Avalanche instead (see below), but it's still complicated.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 7 . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . 9 4 6 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


There are some simpler variations instead of either of the :b9:'s proposed, like the double hane or just connecting black's cut point, but honestly, just about anything is simpler than the large avalanche.

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #16 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:37 pm 
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Rank: kgs 5kyu
KGS: Unusedname
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm11 Prisoners: none
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X X X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O O O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


i don't like this at all. I really don't want this to become an avalanche game where i lose because i didn't know the variations.

3rd line territory is supposed to be even. so if he tries to take the corner i'll extend then turn on him and approach his 4-4 stone.

otherwise i get to keep the corner and he needs to make a move on the right so that i don't just negate his wall.

then i can get the last corner.

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #17 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:42 pm 
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Posts: 415
Location: Antwerp, Belgium
Liked others: 43
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Universal go server handle: tygempanda
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm11 Prisoners: none
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X X X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O O O X 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Booh no complicated joseki. :tmbdown: Ok then I need to think of a new plan while I build more wall :-)

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #18 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:54 pm 
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Rank: kgs 5kyu
KGS: Unusedname
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm11 Prisoners: none
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X X X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O O O X 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


so now i want to turn on his group
i see a cut point but i'm not sure how to exploit it
as far as i can tell simply extending along the side is good enough to defend it

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm11 Prisoners: none
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X X X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . a O O O X 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . b . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I think a is the only move otherwise i turn and his position starts to crumble.

I don't know why i'm getting nervous already, i feel like i'm in a bad position but I know that's ridiculous.
I'm not sure what part of the game is my strength, but the fact that otenki wanted to play out the avalanche joseki is psychologically intimidating.

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #19 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 2:02 pm 
Lives in gote
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Posts: 415
Location: Antwerp, Belgium
Liked others: 43
Was liked: 32
Rank: EGF 2k
Universal go server handle: tygempanda
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm11 Prisoners: none
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X X X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O O O X 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


5-3 ! Pseudo influence from the shin fuseki era :-)

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 Post subject: Re: #191: Otenki vs Unusedname
Post #20 Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:00 pm 
Lives in gote
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Posts: 447
Liked others: 137
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Rank: kgs 5kyu
KGS: Unusedname
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm11 Prisoners: none
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X X X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 5 O O O X 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



lots of thoughts.
this is a type of playstyle i'm not very accustomed to.
Most games i have sente a majority of the match


I did expect him to eventually play the 3-5 stone based on his other game.

but this seems the wrong time to tenuki.

if only because i can turn and he has to respond.

i'm having trouble deciding where to play though

local
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm11 Prisoners: none
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X X X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . b O O O X 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . c . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I want to do A have him defend then extend along the side but a is too high.
so maybe c first

also thinking about B but then approach the 4-4 like i planned but then that helps him develop the bottom.


3-3 invasion
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm11 Prisoners: none
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X 5 X O O O . . . . . 1 X X X 3 . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . , . . . O O O X 2 . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . c . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


part of me wants to invade the 3-3 to see which side he chooses almost 90% sure he'll block the side.
this would make turning unneccessary and then i can just play at c

but now i'm not sure that's a good idea because of the 5-3 stone.



dealing with the 5-3 stone
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm11 Prisoners: none
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X X X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O O O X 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . b . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . a . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I think i'll approach somewhere around 5
make miai of a and b, but right now there is no rush for doing this.


in the end i decided this can't be a bad move.

threatens to develop the top side
threatens to cut the group

but now i'm having second thoughts cause it allows him to fix the cut indirectly

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