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| #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weeds http://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=8305 |
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| Author: | The Intrepid [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 10:33 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | Bill Spight [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 10:58 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
I hope!  Edit: Unhidden. Bingo! |
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| Author: | tj86430 [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | skydyr [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | drishti [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | Uberdude [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
Why did black have 9 stones? |
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| Author: | The Intrepid [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 6:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
Because I keep winning with 9 stones, why else? (We'll probably move onto 8 stones after this game, though.) |
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| Author: | The Intrepid [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 6:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | drishti [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | The Intrepid [ Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | drishti [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 6:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | The Intrepid [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 6:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | drishti [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 6:43 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | The Intrepid [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | Bill Spight [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
White missed his opportunity to resign. Edit: Unhidden. |
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| Author: | The Intrepid [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 8:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
| Author: | skydyr [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 8:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
@Bill Spight |
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| Author: | Bill Spight [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
The Intrepid wrote: Let's make a quick calculation of how much the move is worth. 1). A simplified calculation: Score W = (+5) + (-2) = (+3) Score B = (+2) + (-5) = (-3) (We could have gotten this result by seeing that White and Black stones are symmetrically distributed.) Thus, the move is worth approximately Score Difference = Score W - Score B = (+3) - (-3) = (+6) 2). A more rigorous calculation: This ends in gote for Black. Thus, both players have 50% to play in the area first. If White plays first, the result is: Score WW = +4 If Black plays first, the play is again gote: Thus, each player again has 50% chance to be the first one to play the followup. If White plays first, Score WBW = +3 If Black plays first, Score WBB = +2 Therefore, Score W = 50% * Score WW + 50% * [50% * Score WBW + 50% * Score Score WBB] = (+2) + 0.5 * [(+1.5) + (+1)] = +3.25 By symmetry, Score B = (-1) * Score W = -3.25 Therefore, Score Difference = Score W - Score B = +6.5[/hide] You were right the first time.  Quote:
Thus, each player again has 50% chance to be the first one to play the followup. In this position  is sente. We therefore do not say that each player has a 50% chance of playing here first. We regard as Black's privilege.This position is a bit tricky, however, because in the next diagram is ambiguous between gote and sente.That is, it is not sente, but  gains as much as . Therefore White can play , despite Black's privilege. (The point being that if White plays , Black does not get the chance to raise the local temperature by playing there himself.) Anyway, the exchange, - does not change the local count. Edit: Unhidden. |
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| Author: | Bill Spight [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
skydyr wrote: @Bill Spight Bill Spight wrote: White missed his opportunity to resign. Could you clarify this? What were you looking at as the opportunity to resign? There is a phrase, "looking for a place to resign", which is used when the player who is behind takes desperate measures which, assuming correct play by the opponent, are doomed to fail. White has made a sequence of four plays (  -  ) which could be called looking for a place to resign. Then when Black administered the coup de grace (  ), White did not resign. I suppose that The Intrepid is playing on for the sake of the audience, but drishti deserve a round of applause. Edit: Unhidden. |
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| Author: | The Intrepid [ Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #215: The Intrepid vs. drishti: Deep in the Endgame Weed |
Quote: You were right the first time. Can I look at that hide tag now or only later?
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, 
captures a few stones. Suddenly, Uberdude's question makes quite a bit of sense. 