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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #41 Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:05 pm 
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Did someone see ONE game where black opened with nirensei (two hoshi one the same side)?

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #42 Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:34 pm 
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0.5 difference. Couldn't have been more epic. :clap:

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #43 Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 8:08 pm 
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Pippen wrote:
Did someone see ONE game where black opened with nirensei (two hoshi one the same side)?

No, from the pro games I saw in 2012. Maybe there are some, but seems very unpopular. I wander why.

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #44 Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 9:10 pm 
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Pippen wrote:
Did someone see ONE game where black opened with nirensei (two hoshi one the same side)?

Seo Neungwook (sic?) 9P plays a lot of nirensei as black. He is an older pro from the Cho Hunhyun Era, but still plays these days. He seems to play it mainly to shorten the opening and fight like crazy, rather than for any special strategic consideration.

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #45 Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:03 pm 
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2nd game;

Gu Li defeated Lee Sedol by resign.

Strange and exciting game...

Image

3rd game:12/13/12


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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #46 Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 2:38 pm 
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Gu Li = 21st century Fujisawa Shuko?

Agree, disagree, discuss.

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #47 Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 4:48 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #48 Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 5:10 pm 
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lemmata wrote:
Gu Li = 21st century Fujisawa Shuko?

Agree, disagree, discuss.


I don't understand the comparison. Could you elaborate a little bit?

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #49 Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 10:42 pm 
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cdybeijing wrote:
lemmata wrote:
Gu Li = 21st century Fujisawa Shuko?

Agree, disagree, discuss.
I don't understand the comparison. Could you elaborate a little bit?
Many pros on BadukTV have called Gu Li the world's strongest player during the fuseki phase of the game. Shuko once declared that he was the world's strongest in the first 50 moves; and he may have been right. In Game 2, it felt like Gu Li totally controlled every phase of the opening. To say that he did this against a strong opponent is an understatement.

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #50 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:15 am 
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3rd game;

Lee Sedol defeated Gu Li by 0.5 and took Samsung cup title.

Image

Image
determined facial expression!!!!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #51 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:30 am 
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How did he manage to win by 0.5 BOTH games!!??. :bow:

This feels like Touya Kouyo vs Sai.

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #52 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:30 am 
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Gu Li suffered from same mistake in first game: relaxing during endgame and losing a few points.

They started fighting from the opening and Lee Sedol came out with an advantage. Gu Li made a comeback and entered the endgame with a favorable position. Then with some relaxed moves 154 & 156 lost a few points.



Attachments:
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Last edited by logan on Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #53 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:07 am 
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logan wrote:
Gu Li suffered from same mistake in first game: relaxing during endgame and losing a few points.

They started fighting from the opening and Lee Sedol came out with an advantage. Gu Li made a comeback and entered the endgame with a favorable position. Then with some relaxed moves 154 & 156 lost a few points.



Logan, the commentary about 154 and 156 is your own opinion, or is from some pro commentary?

I am asking because 154 move doesn't seems optional and is not only about tickness - if blacks cut there, I believe white is in real trouble.
And 156, is a huge yose move.

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #54 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:22 am 
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http://badukmovies.com/special_games/51?move=8

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #55 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:03 am 
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Watching these 0.5 pt games makes me realize how bad I am at endgame. :scratch:

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #56 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:05 am 
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logan's sgf for game #3 has the player colors wrong, Lee Sedol was Black.

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #57 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:11 am 
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yoyoma wrote:
logan's sgf for game #3 has the player colors wrong, Lee Sedol was Black.
Thank-you for pointing it out, I've fixed it.

Lucian wrote:
logan wrote:
Logan, the commentary about 154 and 156 is your own opinion, or is from some pro commentary?

I am asking because 154 move doesn't seems optional and is not only about tickness - if blacks cut there, I believe white is in real trouble.
And 156, is a huge yose move.
Yes, it's professional analysis. Also, I think it's known that Gu Li's biggest weakness is his endgame -- enough so that fans will often joke about it when watching or studying his games. Many people are wondering how much Gu Li will take away from these painful losses and how his game will grow over the next year as a result. If you'd like some detailed analysis' for moves 154/56 please let me know and I'll try to post them.

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #58 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:08 am 
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It would be really nice, Logan. =]

Yesterday I reviewed game 2 on KGS with Oren and some others. There is so much going on, middle game ended around move 200.

And yes, he dominated the fuseki stage... Some how it feels wrong when such a strong professional loses because of his weak endgame.

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #59 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:12 pm 
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I've updated my pro title table (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/andrew.j.s ... Table.html). Gu Li was so close to getting his first international title since 2010, I wonder if he will replicate his success of previous years or are the new generation going to take over. Lee Sedol seems to be here to stay for a while. The younger generation make up 3 of the 4 finalists in the upcoming Ing Cup (Park Junghwan 9d of Korea vs Fan Tingyu 3d of China) and Chunlan Cup (Chen Yaoye 9d of China vs Lee Sedol 9d of Korea).

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 Post subject: Re: Samsung cup main tournament
Post #60 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:26 pm 
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lemmata wrote:
Pippen wrote:
Did someone see ONE game where black opened with nirensei (two hoshi one the same side)?

Seo Neungwook (sic?) 9P plays a lot of nirensei as black. He is an older pro from the Cho Hunhyun Era, but still plays these days. He seems to play it mainly to shorten the opening and fight like crazy, rather than for any special strategic consideration.


Seo Nungwuk. Thx, he seems to be the only pro who still opens with nirensei.

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