It is currently Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:34 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ] 
Author Message
Offline
 Post subject: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #1 Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:57 am 
Dies in gote
User avatar

Posts: 35
Liked others: 81
Was liked: 13
Rank: DDK Life
Universal go server handle: Applebaps
Online playing schedule: Evenings M-F UTC-9, Saturday mornings
It's a lot of work to study and improve at Go. We put in hours and hours, working problems, replaying games, watching lectures, watching games, listening to commentary, reading books, and playing and playing and playing. Because the rules of the game are so simple, the game is really "transparent" in a way. The strength of your ideas, your mind, IS your strength on the board; there's no luck, no "execution skill" or reflexes like in fighting games.

So it just makes it all the sweeter when you can see and feel yourself getting better at the game! :D

We had our local club meeting this past Saturday, and I played two games against someone who kicked my butt all over the board a few months ago. I offered a handicap game, saying he was stronger than me, but he said "I'm not so sure about that..." and said we should play even.

I took Black, and proceeded to play like an actual Go player. My ideas were on point, my moves were sharp, and I wasn't afraid of the right moves. I dove in under star points, I crosscut, I listened to the stones and they spoke to me. After the opening, I saw he was building influence along the top and I played to reduce it, and when my opponent saw he wasn't going to be able to get what he wanted, he put his stone back in the bowl.

I've never been able to make him stop and think before. This time, he said, "Oh, hang on... hmm." He sat and thought for nearly a full minute! That's a win in my book. :cool:

I ended up making an overplay invading too deep along one side, and it tore my center to shreds. Lost by less than 20 points, even so. It was very close, and we had a lot of great chit-chat during the game, sort of half-reviewing half-trash-talking as we went, very respectful though.

Then we played on 13x13 and I beat him handily at close-range combat. :rambo:

Our club has 8 people now, 4 of whom are raw beginners, and it was so nice to see everyone playing together having fun. I was able to offer some advice to some of our fresh-faced 30kyus and enjoy my coffee watching so much Go.

Anyway, life is good, Go is good!

Do you have a game like this that sticks with you? When everything started to click and you felt powerful?

_________________
Joseki (n): 1. Japanese term meaning "when Jo lives in seki."


This post by Applebaps was liked by 3 people: fireproof, jlt, MikeKyle
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #2 Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 12:59 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1587
Liked others: 380
Was liked: 300
Rank: 2d-2k
My first win against a KGS 1-dan felt really good. Then I looked at it a couple of years later and a lot of moves really felt aweful.

Beating a KGS 2-dan a while ago felt also really good, then in the review it became clear that - again - I pretty much lucked out. He is still a 2-dan. I'm still 1-kyu on KGS : D

In general I like games where my opponent thinks he got away with everything but loses on points : D

_________________
My "guide" to become stronger in Go


This post by SoDesuNe was liked by: Applebaps
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #3 Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:09 pm 
Dies in gote
User avatar

Posts: 35
Liked others: 81
Was liked: 13
Rank: DDK Life
Universal go server handle: Applebaps
Online playing schedule: Evenings M-F UTC-9, Saturday mornings
SoDesuNe wrote:
My first win against a KGS 1-dan felt really good. Then I looked at it a couple of years later and a lot of moves really felt aweful.

Beating a KGS 2-dan a while ago felt also really good, then in the review it became clear that - again - I pretty much lucked out. He is still a 2-dan. I'm still 1-kyu on KGS : D


Hey, a win is a win, right? If we can learn from it, so much the better.

SoDesuNe wrote:
In general I like games where my opponent thinks he got away with everything but loses on points : D


Sneaky sneaky, I like it. :)

_________________
Joseki (n): 1. Japanese term meaning "when Jo lives in seki."

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #4 Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:20 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 106
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 25
SoDesuNe wrote:
My first win against a KGS 1-dan felt really good. Then I looked at it a couple of years later and a lot of moves really felt aweful.

Beating a KGS 2-dan a while ago felt also really good, then in the review it became clear that - again - I pretty much lucked out. He is still a 2-dan. I'm still 1-kyu on KGS : D

In general I like games where my opponent thinks he got away with everything but loses on points : D


I pretty much find that every single game that I play is based on "luck". When I run an AI analysis, there is at least 1 occurrence where the win percentage fluctuate heavily from one side to the other. Major mistakes are unknowingly committed and opportunities are missed but both sides in amateur matches, since we are incapable for playing perfect matches. Perhaps gaining control over what we consider "luck" is what real skill is about in Go.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #5 Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 8:18 am 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1587
Liked others: 380
Was liked: 300
Rank: 2d-2k
I think I know what you mean, but I don't refer to luck in go as the general ability to play the best move (or to be more conrete the opponent's failure to play it). For me it's more a situational component like the state of mind of your opponent.

Look at this wingraph:

Image


White had a clearly won game. Then over many moves, White "chose" to let me get a ko. White could have backed up at every turn and still win the game. The ko - in itself - was not game-deciding, too. But as we exchanged threats - of which I had many due to a dead but still twitching group - I managed to save this group. In the game White could still win, because I was fine with living on my own and didn't want to start a humongous semai (I don't count and thought the game was at least even now - this would have been my opponent's luck then ; )). But lucky for me, White tenukid and didn't see that I could cut his group with my now living stones. White only had one eye.

Those situations I call luck.

At every turn my opponent was without doubt able enough to play better moves but somehow I got through with my shenanigans.

_________________
My "guide" to become stronger in Go

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #6 Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:11 am 
Lives in sente

Posts: 1282
Location: Earth
Liked others: 467
Was liked: 209
You win a game because you make 1.) less mistakes, 2.) smaller mistakes or 3.) your opponent makes the last mistake. ;-)

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #7 Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 12:45 pm 
Dies in gote
User avatar

Posts: 35
Liked others: 81
Was liked: 13
Rank: DDK Life
Universal go server handle: Applebaps
Online playing schedule: Evenings M-F UTC-9, Saturday mornings
Personally I feel like winrate percentages and graphing kinda sucks the fun out of the game, but whatever floats your boat.

_________________
Joseki (n): 1. Japanese term meaning "when Jo lives in seki."

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #8 Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 1:37 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1587
Liked others: 380
Was liked: 300
Rank: 2d-2k
Applebaps wrote:
Personally I feel like winrate percentages and graphing kinda sucks the fun out of the game, but whatever floats your boat.


That's okay of course!

Since I often tend to "feel" my way around a lot of positions I like the "greater clarity" LZ offers with its win-percentages. I still like to improve, so even if I feel good about a position I like to know if that's actually the case from a stronger player's point of view.

_________________
My "guide" to become stronger in Go

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #9 Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:43 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 106
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 25
Applebaps wrote:
Personally I feel like winrate percentages and graphing kinda sucks the fun out of the game, but whatever floats your boat.


I think it's fine if you want to do hard analysis using robots.

Liking graphs and percentages is not really the point though. The point is that objectively speaking, there are mistakes being made by both parties at lower levels that could swing the outcome of the game constantly, and people often consider this phenomenon as "luck".

You don't need to look at graphs to see this.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #10 Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:59 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 127
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Liked others: 42
Was liked: 71
Rank: Australian 2 dan
GD Posts: 200
Applebaps wrote:
Personally I feel like winrate percentages and graphing kinda sucks the fun out of the game, but whatever floats your boat.

When I was first learning go, I had a flatmate who was a stronger player. So I could study something, get myself all confused, and then say "hey, what do you think of this?"

Nowadays I'm the only go player in my household. The winrates and graphs are my easiest way of saying "what do you think of this?" without having to leave the house. Not as sociable, but more accurate -- got to take those silver linings where you find them!


This post by xela was liked by: Applebaps
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Growing stronger feels really good
Post #11 Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:12 am 
Dies in gote
User avatar

Posts: 35
Liked others: 81
Was liked: 13
Rank: DDK Life
Universal go server handle: Applebaps
Online playing schedule: Evenings M-F UTC-9, Saturday mornings
That's a fair point, actually.

_________________
Joseki (n): 1. Japanese term meaning "when Jo lives in seki."

Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group