It's not that I hate it, but I just think it's boring
I like to have some different opening (joseki) options.
Therefore I do not play games with four 4-4's often.
But if it does happen it's not something I would dislike on principle.

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Laurens
Go school: freegame's Teaching School
Author of: The Next Move a book for 15-3kyu players.

For everybody who hates it so much, nobody's forcing you to play a 4-4 for either Black 3 or White 4.

I usually play a 4-4 followed by a 3-4, whether I have Black or White. The exception is if I have Black and White gives me the possibility to play a diagonal fuseki; I usually take that opportunity because it seems that my opponents aren't quite as good at dealing with diagonal fusekis as they are with the Chinese, Kobayashi, or any other fuseki that involves playin in adjacent corners for Black 1 and 3.

Not that it's helped my play very much.

Like this?

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[go]$$B popular opening?
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I've noticed a lot of my recent opponents opened with this. As for an all 4-4 game I don't dislike it, until they start invading that is . The problem I find is that if I start to enclose my corners (and playing small-ish) the opponent grabs the big points somewhere else, but if I play for the big points first I almost always end up getting invaded and/or losing a corner

I almost always play 4 4 openings as white. But pretty much never do it as black.

I've always played at least a 3-4 point since 12k or so, I've completely forgotten what all 4-4 points are like now...

It seems silly to talk about choosing 4-4 or 4-3 based on what you like without any regard to the fuseki being played out.

If the choice of corner plays doesn't have regard for the fuseki, I don't know what does.

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So you've got an eye?
That don't impress me much

Yes, that's exactly what I mean. Depending on my mood, I can play 5 at a, or play the Kobayashi.



I have much the same problem. That, and my invasions don't work, but my opponents' invasions do.

My philosophy is force yourself to play anything you are uncomfortable with. If it is considered acceptable at a professional level, then any failure to make it work for you is a failure to understand what to do with it, which hints at a gap in Go knowledge. If repeatedly playing it and analysing high level games involving it make you more comfortable with the move, then it's possible that your study gave insights into principles of Go that help your game (both with that opening and with Go generally).

It strikes me that it's the moves we find hard to handle, or hard to play as well as other people seem to, that are the ones waiting to teach us what we don't yet understand.

FWIW: As Black I always play 4-4 in the upper right corner. That will probably never change. For years I played only san-ren-sei as Black because Micheal Redmond likes that opening, but it got stale. Lately I've been having more luck with the Chinese. Very recently, I've begun playing diagonal fusekis when White offers, though I've always favored parallel fuseki because my natural style is a moyo style.

In other words, I like a plan I can stick with, but they seem to get stale after a while.

I like all 4-4 alright, but I don't like it when the first 9 moves are all on the star points.

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be immersed

Well most of my games are not quadro 4-4 but I cant say I hate it or something.

If I'm in fighting mood I play 2x 4-4 because the opening seems easier without sneaky 4-3 pincer joseki stuff and I can focus on the fighting in the middle game.

Yeah, strong players keep saying thickness is OK, but I can't remember even one game of mine where giving up territory in exchange for thickness has been anything less than a disaster.

Exchanging territory for thickness does not in itself give an advantage. You have to make use of that thickness in subsequent plays in order to profit. If you go and settle positions quickly it's difficult to profit from thickness. Keep things open and groups will start to die left and right for your opponent as the game progresses.

Yes, it's easier said than done

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