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So bad at endgame trick?
https://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=14143
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Author:  Krama [ Mon Apr 03, 2017 6:17 am ]
Post subject:  So bad at endgame trick?

I am so bad at endgame that I usually just count on losing 15 points in the endgame itself so I play to get at least that much advantage in middle game. I guess it's just a silly tool I learned myself to compensate for poor endgame skills.

Which are the best beginner books or tutorials to learn the proper endgame techniques?

Author:  Bill Spight [ Mon Apr 03, 2017 8:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: So bad at endgame trick?

As an SDK you are hardly a beginner. :)

IMO the best place to start is with endgame tesuji. Don't worry about calculating the size of plays yet. You have to know (potentially) correct play to do that. Learn correct play first.

Fortunately, there are good resources online. For instance, http://senseis.xmp.net/?GokyoSeimyoTsumegoSeries . SL calls these tsumego problems, but they are really endgame problems involving play inside the opponent's "territory". That's a good place to start because you learn how to turn the tables at the very end of the game. :) Most of the problems do not seem to show the solutions on SL. You can look at the problems and then check the solutions in the book, which you can download from Waseda University. http://archive.wul.waseda.ac.jp/kosho/wo09/wo09_04079/ The book is volume 3.

Volume 2 of the Gokyo Seimyo is also good for endgame technique. Those problems start on page 13. Here is the first one.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B Black to play
$$ ------------------------
$$ . . . . . O . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . X O . . O . . |
$$ . . X X . X O O X O . . |
$$ . . , . . X X X O O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


Become a killer in the endgame. :D

Good luck!

Author:  hyperpape [ Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: So bad at endgame trick?

Problem:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ------------------------
$$ . . . . 3 O 5 1 4 . . . |
$$ . . . . . X O 2 b O . . |
$$ . . X X . X O O X O . . |
$$ . . , . . X X X O O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


First thought was 1. White can't play at :b5:, or Black can descend at b. At the end, Black has :b3: in sente, and has captured one stone. Is there a better solution?

Author:  RobertJasiek [ Mon Apr 03, 2017 11:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: So bad at endgame trick?

Krama wrote:
Which are the best beginner books or tutorials to learn the proper endgame techniques?


Answer: viewtopic.php?p=218129#p218129

Author:  Pio2001 [ Tue Apr 04, 2017 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: So bad at endgame trick?

Krama wrote:
I am so bad at endgame that I usually just count on losing 15 points in the endgame itself so I play to get at least that much advantage in middle game. I guess it's just a silly tool I learned myself to compensate for poor endgame skills.

Which are the best beginner books or tutorials to learn the proper endgame techniques?


Hi,
It depends if you look for endgame tesuji, or endgame fundamentals.

First find some reviews about the book The Endgame, by Tomoko Ogawa and James Davies. Robert Jasiek just gave a bad review about it, but in my club, I've heard that it was a good book.

Among my books, there are two that explain the basics of endgame (double sente, reverse sente, double gote, big endgame, small endgame...) : Learn to Play Go vol 5, by Janice kim and Jeong Soo-Hyun, 49 pages about endgame. It also explains how to count the exact value of the moves. And First Fundamentals, by Robert Jasiek, 19 pages about endgame.
I've also got Endgame Fundamentals, by Robert Jasiek, but I've not read it yet. It seems to deal with endgame in a very broad way : any situation where the status of the groups can't change anymore, be it during the opening, the middle game or the endgame.

Author:  Shaddy [ Tue Apr 04, 2017 10:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: So bad at endgame trick?

@hyperpape:

How about this?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ------------------------
$$ . . . 4 . O 2 1 . . . . |
$$ . . . . . X O . 3 O . . |
$$ . . X X . X O O X O . . |
$$ . . , . . X X X O O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Author:  Matti [ Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: So bad at endgame trick?

Shaddy wrote:
@hyperpape:

How about this?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ------------------------
$$ . . . 4 . O 2 1 . . . . |
$$ . . . . . X O . 3 O . . |
$$ . . X X . X O O X O . . |
$$ . . , . . X X X O O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ------------------------
$$ . 4 1 O . O O X . . . . |
$$ 6 3 2 5 . X O . X O . . |
$$ . . X X . X O O X O . . |
$$ . . , . . X X X O O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


Looks like a big ko. White can play if he has threats.

Author:  DrStraw [ Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: So bad at endgame trick?

How about this?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ------------------------
$$ . . . 4 6 O 2 1 . . . . |
$$ . . . 7 5 X O . 3 O . . |
$$ . . X X . X O O X O . . |
$$ . . , . . X X X O O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


The assumption is that there are no more stones so the group is just forced along the edge and captured.

Author:  Matti [ Sat Aug 12, 2017 3:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: So bad at endgame trick?

DrStraw wrote:
How about this?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ------------------------
$$ . . . 4 6 O 2 1 . . . . |
$$ . . . 7 5 X O . 3 O . . |
$$ . . X X . X O O X O . . |
$$ . . , . . X X X O O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


The assumption is that there are no more stones so the group is just forced along the edge and captured.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 1 O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . X O O X O . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

How?

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