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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #281 Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 7:27 am 
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Oooops! Sorry!

I could nearly feel my head away from my body! :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #282 Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 4:18 pm 
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The heroine of this thread winning against Umezawa / Yoshihara Yukari in Female Honinbo. In her first April win.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3LvpxciK8I

I am totally surprised to find Nihon Kiin livestreaming on youtube.

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #283 Posted: Sat Apr 17, 2021 5:48 am 
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Sumire had a big week, with 3 important wins. The 1st win on Apr 12 earned her the right to play in main Female Saikyo tournament, while her other two wins were in the major mixed tournament, so they count for promotion by wins and prize money. April updates are in blue.

April games:
    [1] Apr 1: Defeated Yoshihara Yukari(6p) in Female Honimbo 40
    [2] Apr 5: Defeated Okada Yumiko 6p in Meijin 47.
    [3] Apr 12: Defeated Hiromi Mizuno 5p in Female Saikyo 6
    [4] Apr 14: Defeated Hara Masakazu 3p in Kisei 46
    [5] Apr 15: Defeated SAKAGUCHI, Ryuzo, 9p in Judan 60


Here is a summary of all her tournaments (she is out of tournaments with black names). She is still active in tournaments with red names:

Major tournaments (eligible for prize money rule and promotion by wins):
  • Kisei 46 - Defeated Ha Youngil (6p, 35 years old, rating 3040, #530) on Feb 4, Tajima Shingo (但馬 慎吾, 6p, 2879, #805) on March 11 and
    Hara Masakazu (原 正和 3p, 23 yrs, 3059, #495) on Apr 14. Will play TORII, Yuta (3p, 28yrs, 2964, #668) in last game of prelims. If she wins, she will make it to C league, which would be a huge achievement.
    See West block 3 in https://www.nihonkiin.or.jp/match/kisei/046.html.
  • Meijin 47 - Defeated Okada Yumiko 6p on Apr 5. Will play NOBUTA, Shigehito (信田 成仁六段 6p, 60 yrs) next. See Tokyo 16 in https://www.nihonkiin.or.jp/match/meijin/047.html
  • Honimbo 77 - eliminated on Dec 3, 2020. Honimbo 78 should start around Oct 2021?.
  • Oza 69 - eliminated in Oct 2020. Oza 70 should start in March 2021
  • Tengen 48 - Will play Atti Tormanen (1p) in 1st round. See Tokyo 23 https://www.nihonkiin.or.jp/match/tengen/048.html
  • Gosei 47 - Defeated Rafif Shidqi Fitrah (1p, 18 yrs) in first round of qualifying on March 29. Will play Ryoya Takeshita (竹下 凌矢) 1p next. See Tokyo 4.
  • Judan 60 - Defeated Minematsu Matsaki (6p, 2698, 57yr old) in first round of qualifying on Jan 21, 2021 and SAKAGUCHI, Ryuzo, 9p on Apr 15. Will play GOTO, Shungo (8p, 2979, #645) next. See Kansai/Chubu frame 8 https://www.nihonkiin.or.jp/match/jyudan/060.html

Mixed tournaments counting towards promotion by wins:
  • Kiryama (aka Agon) 28 - defeated Yasufumi Tahara (7p, 46yrs, 2714, #1000) on Mar 1st and MATSUBARA Taisei (6p, 49yrs, 2772, #948) on Mar 15 but lost to Koyama Kuya (4p, 24 yrs, 3171, #332) that same day. So she is out of Kiryama 28. Kiryama 29 should start Feb 2022.
  • Ryusei 30 - Defeated Araki Issei 4P on June 29, 2020 in final of prelim B. Lost to Nakano Shoya 1p in Prelim A. Ryusei 31 should start in April-Jun 2021?
  • Hiroshima 15 (Young Carp). Eliminated in Nov 2020. Hiroshima 16 should start Sept 2021.
  • Okage (Thanks Cup) 11 - eliminated on Apr 6, 2020 by Xie Yimmin. Okage 12 should start in March 2021
  • SGW Nakajima 3 - did not participate? SGW 4 should start in Aug 2021
  • Globis Cup 8 should have started Jan 2021

Women-only or other tournaments not counting for promotion:
  • Shinjin (King of New Stars) 46 - eliminated in Nov 16, 2020. Shinjin 47 should start in Nov 2021.
  • Okan (Crown) Cup - Not eligible (seems to be for Nagoya branch only).
  • Kansai Go open 1: eliminated in Nov 2020 in the semifinal of class C (this was in main tournament). Kansai Open 2 might start Sept 2021 (but she might not be eligible to play anymore).
  • Wakatake 5: Lost to Hiroki Muramatsu 6p in first round on Nov 29, 2020. Her opponent eventually ended up in 3rd place. It seems to be Kansai only, so she will probably not play in it next year.
  • Female Honimbo 40: Defeated Saeka Iwata 1p on Jan 25, 2021, Takao Mari (髙雄 茉莉, 1p, 19 yrs) on Feb 18 in prelims. Defeated Yukari Yoshihara (吉原由香里 6p 48 yrs) on April 1st in first round. Will play Nyu Eiko (3p) next. See https://gotoeveryone.k2ss.info/news/jp/fhoninbo/40.
  • Female Meijin 32: Defeated Akiko Tsukuda 5p (2741) on Jan 7, 2021 but lost to Ueno Asami in last qualifying game on the same day. Female Meijin 33 should start in Nov 2021?
  • Female Aizu (aka Tachiaoi) 8: Defeated Chiharu Miyamoto 1p on Dec 17, Fumiko Sakakibara 6p on Jan 18, 2021, Akane Tatsuni (辰己 茜, 3p, 38yrs) on Feb 11 and Wang Jing Yi (王 景怡, 3p, 35yrs, 2769, #934) on March 18 in last qualifying game, so she has made it to the main
    tournament. Will play Konishi Kazuko (8p, 49yrs) in 1st round. See https://gotoeveryone.k2ss.info/news/jp/tachiaoi/8
  • Female Kisei 24 - Lost in 2nd round of main tournament to Aoki Kikuyo 8p on Oct 26. Kisei 25 should start July 2021.
  • Female Senko/Saikyo 6: Defeated Tamura Chiaki (3p, 42yrs, 2648, #1029) in 2nd round of qualifying on Mar 10th and Hiromi Mizuno 5p (水野 弘美, 53yrs) in last qualifying game on Apr 12, so she made it to the main tournament. See West 4 of https://www.nihonkiin.or.jp/match/senko/006.html

My calculations show her results to be as follows:
In 2021: 18-2 (#2 in overall 2021 Japanese ranking by wins on gotoeveryone web site).
In 2020: 21-17
Overall: 58-28
Go rating: 2952, #692

Promotion to 3p: 4 wins (40 required):
  • Gosei 47: 1 win (ongoing)
  • Meijin 47: 1 win (ongoing)
  • Kisei 46: 1 win (ongoing)
  • Judan 60: 1 win (ongoing)

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #284 Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 12:14 pm 
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Sumire has been playing with the Japanese national squad in an internet match against Taiwan. In two rounds played so far, both Sumire and Ichiriki Ryo scored 2-0. Overall the match score was 3-3 in both rounds. Sumire beat Yang Zixuan 4-dan (female, 18) and Yu Lijun 3-dan (female, 21). Further rounds will be played at 2-monthly intervals, but maybe with different players.

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #285 Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:39 pm 
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Sumire defeated Nobuta Shigehito in the #47 Meijin prelims.

Next is Cho Sonjin. I wish it was another Cho ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #286 Posted: Tue Apr 27, 2021 7:20 pm 
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pajaro wrote:
Next is Cho Sonjin. I wish it was another Cho ;-)


It looks like she has to win one more before Cho. She plays the winner of Komatsu Hideki vs Tanaka Yuki? Then Cho Sonjin, then Michael Redmond if she keeps winning.

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #287 Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:03 am 
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botija wrote:
It looks like she has to win one more before Cho.


You are right. My mistake.

If she ends up playing Michael Redmond, perhaps he will make a video. That would be nice. But there is still a long way before that.

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #288 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:04 am 
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Her game against Goto Shungo in the 60th Judan was up on Tygem, not that common an occurrence for Japanese games outside of big titles finals (and even then...). I guess Sumire's results interest the Korean public too.

Here is the game (possible transcription errors mine).


Attachments:
GotoShungo-Nakamura Sumire.sgf [1.5 KiB]
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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #289 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:44 am 
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Quote:
I guess Sumire's results interest the Korean public too.


Don't forget that Sumire has studied in Korea and speaks some Korean.

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #290 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:45 am 
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19 wins for only 2 losses :o :o
90% of victory, really impressive, I hope she keeps it up!

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #291 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:48 am 
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John Fairbairn wrote:
Quote:
I guess Sumire's results interest the Korean public too.


Don't forget that Sumire has studied in Korea and speaks some Korean.
True I had forgotten about it. Thanks!

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #292 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2021 11:42 am 
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Shenoute wrote:
Her game against Goto Shungo in the 60th Judan was up on Tygem, not that common an occurrence for Japanese games outside of big titles finals (and even then...). I guess Sumire's results interest the Korean public too.

Here is the game (possible transcription errors mine).



I found this game interesting.

Nowadays, it seems that AI style is everywhere, all players are playing 3-3 invasions early and so on. And from what I got from Michael Redmond's videos "AlphaGo vs. the world", it seems that AI style is territory oriented. Yes, there are different AI, AlphaGo itself has evolved,... But, even so, in this game black (the younger player) won with a big territory. I don't think it was the plan from the beggining, it was not Takemiya style (tm). From my point of view, the game just developed in that way. But the result was different to other games I have watched lately.

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #293 Posted: Mon May 03, 2021 12:40 am 
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Sumire has moved into the challengers' semi-finals of the ladies' 8th Aidu Chuo Hospital Tachiaoi Cup, having defeated Konishi Kauko 8-dan. She will now face Nyu Eiko 3-dan. If she makes it through to the final, she will be up against either Ueno Asami or Kato Chie.

Sumire's quarter-final game was one of the queerest pro games I've ever seen - almost certainly the most one-sided. But not in the usual sense. In this case it was because 146 out of the first 156 moves were down side of the board, and mostly on the edges. On top of that, several of the moves made me blink in disbelief. Here is the one-sided portion - and even at this stage this side is still far from finished, with huge sacrifices by Sumire.

Remember those bleating voices that said Sumire shouldn't have been allowed to become a pro by recommendation?


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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #294 Posted: Mon May 03, 2021 2:58 pm 
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John Fairbairn wrote:
Remember those bleating voices that said Sumire shouldn't have been allowed to become a pro by recommendation?


Yes, they have disappeared.

But I have been thinking about this, that perhaps we misunderstand the real reason WHY this was done. Obviously, in spite of how her strength was (correctly) judged, one might have thought a short time as an insei wouldn't have hurt.

Wouldn't have hurt HER.

But what would it have done to the confidence of her fellow insei?

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #295 Posted: Tue May 04, 2021 1:08 am 
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Mike Novack wrote:
John Fairbairn wrote:
Remember those bleating voices that said Sumire shouldn't have been allowed to become a pro by recommendation?


Yes, they have disappeared.

But I have been thinking about this, that perhaps we misunderstand the real reason WHY this was done. Obviously, in spite of how her strength was (correctly) judged, one might have thought a short time as an insei wouldn't have hurt.

Wouldn't have hurt HER.

But what would it have done to the confidence of her fellow insei?


Touya theory makes some sense regarding amateur tournaments, however you could argue that it would have the opposite effect on aspiring professionals, and anyway as far as I know Shibano Toramanu and Ichiriki Ryo were both at least as strong and they were, to the best of my knowledge, insei (the former perhaps playing Antti Törmänen while there. Choi Qionlong and Yu Senko were also almost as strong.

The insei system has a specific purpose which, like Touya, she could afford to skip.

Mamumamu has updated the age comparison section (however, ironically, such a comparison actually works best with the whole-history rating system), from which I only now found out that in addition to Lee Changho and Han Sanghoon, Yang Dingxin could be added to the list of early bloomers . . . But he's yet to win an international title. So perhaps the opinion of pros is most important here-when John Fairbairn said that pros seem to mean that her intuitive ability made her stand out for her age, it reminded me about someone saying that the reading ability of the Chinese (and Korean) insei are just as good as the top pros but there intuition is not as good. Sumire sensei's one of the exceptions, I guess. So which of these Japanese professionals would reach an international final at the earliest age (the Ing cup being the closest approach so far)?

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #296 Posted: Tue May 04, 2021 4:31 am 
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Quote:
Dingxin could be added to the list of early bloomers . . . But he's yet to win an international title.


LG will be disappointed that you don't regard their cup as an international title.

But mention of that brings up a very relevant point. Yang got a special promotion to 7-dan and the day after got promoted to 9-dan in 2019 for winning the LG Cup. The special promotions are ubiquitous now. But basically they are a form of promotion by recommendation, aren't they?

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #297 Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 1:17 am 
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Nakamura Sumire has just won the Kisei Prelims, goes into C league to have a (long) shot at the title.
B+5.5 against Torii 3p.

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 Post subject: Re: Following Nakamura Sumire
Post #298 Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 5:23 am 
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kyulearner wrote:
Nakamura Sumire has just won the Kisei Prelims, goes into C league to have a (long) shot at the title.


If I am not mistaken, 14 wins and boom, she is Kisei.

Funny fact: she would be allowed to lose more games in the title match (3) than in her way to become challenger (0).

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