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Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017
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Author:  pookpooi [ Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

Is it too early? Actually, if someone makes poll before Bonobo then it's really too early LOL.
But since we know all players now, let's put instinct to work ;)
I had guessed slightly wrong on Lee Sedol vs. AlphaGo match and very wrong on Cho Chikun vs. DeepZenGo match, hope third time's a charm for me.
*This poll allows re-voting, I don't think anybody will change their vote based on what's other people is voting though.

More discussion is going on in this thread
The original announcement
News on other two professionals

Author:  pookpooi [ Sun Mar 05, 2017 9:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

website that has details in English is up

http://www.worldgochampionship.net/english/

Author:  DrStraw [ Mon Mar 06, 2017 6:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

I am surprised that with all the resources they have and as long as English has been used in go that that page sounds so stilled. Don't they have fluent speakers to write these things?

Author:  pookpooi [ Mon Mar 06, 2017 8:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

My comment is that I don't like time format.
Absolute time should demolished in go already, it's too strict, and oriented toward computer.

Author:  dsatkas [ Tue Mar 07, 2017 7:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

yeah, absolute time is stupid for humans

Author:  Schachus [ Tue Mar 07, 2017 8:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

Is it clear, it's absolute time? "a countdown starts when the remaining time become 5minutes or less" sounds to me like it could be 5*1min byo-yomi at the end.

Author:  Uberdude [ Tue Mar 07, 2017 8:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

As Schachus says, I expect "countdown" is how they translated byo-yomi. We wouldn't want the humans losing on time because Zen keeps playing nonsense moves inside their territory! The lack of a lunch break is more concerning to me: I hope they are at least allowed to eat/drink at the board even if that means poor manners and a risk of greasy fingers on nice stones because brains don't work well when they are hungry.

Author:  HermanHiddema [ Tue Mar 07, 2017 8:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

Yep, definitely 5 x 1 minute byoyomi.

Author:  gowan [ Tue Mar 07, 2017 8:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

I just wonder how time handicaps could be done. What if computers were really short-timed, such as one second per move? Of course the human players might have five minutes per move. Would that equalize the playing field?

Author:  Uberdude [ Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

Time handicaps for computers are almost meaningless unless you also restrict the processing power, because a program that is X strong on Y computer with 5 minutes of time per move could be the same X strong with 1 second a move if you give it computer about (in terms of number of 0s) 5*60 = 300 times as powerful as Y. There are of course economic limits (and eventually "no super-computer that big exists yet") on increasing the power, but you can't plug more brains into Park/Iyama/Mi to make them play as well in 1 second as 1 minute. Also don't forget you'd also have to essentially double the human's time if you want them to have the same as before as they can no longer usefully think on the bots minuscule time (of course you have to turn off pondering for this).

Author:  Schachus [ Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

Uberdude wrote:
Time handicaps for computers are almost meaningless unless you also restrict the processing power, because a program that is X strong on Y computer with 5 minutes of time per move could be the same X strong with 1 second a move if you give it computer about (in terms of number of 0s) 5*60 = 300 times as powerful as Y. There are of course economic limits (and eventually "no super-computer that big exists yet") on increasing the power, but you can't plug more brains into Park/Iyama/Mi to make them play as well in 1 second as 1 minute. Also don't forget you'd also have to essentially double the human's time if you want them to have the same as before as they can no longer usefully think on the bots minuscule time (of course you have to turn off pondering for this).


Also, I even think the humans chances might get worse, because it's psychologically very hard to think for hours and have your opponent always blitz out an instant reply, which feels like "Ha! I saw that coming".

Author:  Ulquiorra [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 1:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

gowan wrote:
I just wonder how time handicaps could be done. What if computers were really short-timed, such as one second per move? Of course the human players might have five minutes per move. Would that equalize the playing field?


Why are we trying so hard to handicap the computers? If we don't like losing, the humans should just git gud. Besides Zen did not beat Chou Chikun, so it should already be a fair match even if its leveled up a bit.

Anyways, I'll cast my bet for Iyama Yuuta, just for the novelty of having Japan win at Go again.

Author:  pookpooi [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

There should be livestream with English commentaries for this event.

Author:  Baywa [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

HermanHiddema wrote:
Yep, definitely 5 x 1 minute byoyomi.


Here's what I got from the japanese site:

持ち時間3時間、残り5分から秒読み

Google translate:

Mochijikan 3-jikan, nokori 5-bu kara byōyomi
Duration 3 hours, remaining 5 minutes to countdown

For what it's worth...

Author:  oren [ Thu Mar 09, 2017 10:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

Baywa wrote:
Duration 3 hours, remaining 5 minutes to countdown
For what it's worth...


Yes, it's a common Japanese time keeping. For most of us playing online, it's basically 2:55 + 5 x 1m per side.

Author:  pookpooi [ Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

Michael Redmond and Anti Tourmanen will provide World Go Championship live commentaries via Youtube stream

Author:  pookpooi [ Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

Preliminary Draw
First day: DeepZenGo vs. Mi Yuting, Park Jungwhan vs. Iyama Yuta
Second Day: Park Jungwhan vs. DeepZenGo, Mi Yuting vs. Iyama Yura
Third Day: Iyama Yuta vs. DeepZenGo, Park Jungwhan vs. Mi Yuting
Image

Author:  pookpooi [ Mon Mar 20, 2017 6:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

Park Jungwhan is 2 hours late
Edit: He's not late, but just in time for the match (15 minutes) but it looks like everyone is waiting for him to arrive

Author:  pookpooi [ Mon Mar 20, 2017 10:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

If you watch through Nico video, you can see winrate provide by DeepZenGo for both game (though not at the same time)
And sometimes they'll show heat map too (but like once every 30 minutes or so)
Image

Author:  pookpooi [ Mon Mar 20, 2017 11:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Predict the winner of World Go Championship 2017

DeepZenGo evaluation right now
DeepZenGo 84% vs. Mi Yuting 16%
Iyama Yuta 52% vs. Park Jungwhan 48%

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