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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #161 Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 6:48 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 145
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Universal go server handle: tegais
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm91 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 3 O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 6 1 2 . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | 5 O 4 X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


After this White have several options to complicate things.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | 4 2 O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 5 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | 3 X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


The first is like this. Numbers to mark stones finished earlier than the variation so it leaves some hope.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 4 6 X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 1 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O 3 2 8 0 . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . 7 9 . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X Q . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


The second.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 4 X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 2 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 1 . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . . 5 . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 8 X 7 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


The third has the same idea as the first.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 8 4 6 X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 3 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 2 1 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . 7 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X 9 . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline
 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #162 Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 8:01 am 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4892
Location: Banbeck Vale
Liked others: 778
Was liked: 1155
Rank: 1D AGA
GD Posts: 1512
Kaya handle: Test
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm91 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 3 O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 6 1 2 . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | 5 O 4 X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | 7 X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Trigger:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm91 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . 8 O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 9 3 O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 6 1 2 . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | 5 O 4 X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | 7 X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Second trigger:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm99 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | 2 O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 3 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

If he accepts the triggers, white creates one eye at B8. ( The circled points are miai )
He might not do them immediately, but he has to sooner or later. If I get A7, that destroys the westward miai pair, then in some variations D8 by me threatens to make one big eye with D7. So I suspect that he will accept the triggers.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm99 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | C O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | C . C C . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Once he has one eye secured, the focus switches to the second one. He has to make it in the middle of the board.

If he cuts at 1, I have to respond with 2, otherwise he kills my lower left group.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Can white get the second eye in this position?
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X 1 . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I think that I can kill. At least, in all variations that I have looked at, I can. ( Although some liberties races that I have read are in my favor by only one move. )

We have managed to get ourselves into a game-deciding fight here. If he dies, I have a 60+ point corner, giving me a winning advantage. If he lives, much of my lower side territory is compromised, giving him a similar advantage.

I expect that one of us resigns within 15 moves.


There is one compromise possible. He could concede the left side group and play the invasion of 1 below, and if I tried to trap it, it would be just enough to tip the fight in his favor. So I'd have to let him have a successful invasion.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X . . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . . 2 . 1 . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I don't think that we will see this. Based upon my opponent's current play, compromise does not seem to be his style.

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Offline
 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #163 Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 4:06 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 145
Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk, (GMT+07:00)
Liked others: 1
Was liked: 14
KGS: 2k
IGS: 4k
DGS: 3d
OGS: 3d
Universal go server handle: tegais
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm99 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | 2 O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . . 4 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 3 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I decided that I like the last variation the most.

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Offline
 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #164 Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 9:42 am 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4892
Location: Banbeck Vale
Liked others: 778
Was liked: 1155
Rank: 1D AGA
GD Posts: 1512
Kaya handle: Test
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


He chooses the most complicated version. :clap: My groups will be hanging on by their fingernails.
I hope nobody slips. There is no room for error here.

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #165 Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 2:00 pm 
Tengen
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Posts: 4892
Location: Banbeck Vale
Liked others: 778
Was liked: 1155
Rank: 1D AGA
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Kaya handle: Test
Again, I almost stumbled into disaster.

He has one eye, and if he gets another, his group lives and he wins the game.
I can't let him capture D7 and make an eye there.

The natural move to play is this. It seems to be the most direct method of connecting D7 out:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O B . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . . 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

But it doesn't work.

White plays like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . . 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I can't play 5 above, or he gets the second eye:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 The circled points are miai
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . C 5 C X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 6 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

So I must atari with 5 from below. He connects with 6, and I must connect with 7:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O 7 5 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

All of that is simple and forced. I must play it or he gets an eye at D7.

Next, white cuts at 8:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O 7 5 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O 0 . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X 8 . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 9 . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I can't let him play 9 or he will kill my corner.

Now with 10 he threatens both my single stone and my group of three. I must rescue the three, or he makes an eye there.
[ The really sharp-eyed observer may note that a different play here leads to a ko, but that isn't much of an improvement for me since he has a bunch of internal ko threats. ]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O X X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O O 1 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 2 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

He captures my single stone. It is a false eye, of course, so I'm still in the game.

I play 3 which will gain some leverage in the future. ( More on that later ) His reply at 4 is forced. Then I save my three stones with 5. He still only has one eye.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O X X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O O 1 5 . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O 4 2 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 3 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Then he cuts off my corner with 6:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O X X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O O 1 5 . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O 4 2 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 3 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 X 6 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . C . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I could play 7 at C1 or D1. It does not get any better. My corner is cut off and still needs another move to have two eyes.

Note that if I had not sacrificed at 3, he could now play 8 at B1, killing my corner.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ | O O O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O X X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O O 1 5 . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O . 2 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 X 6 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

But with 3 in place, he can't:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Black kills white 6 to save his corner
$$ | O O O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O X X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O O 1 5 . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O 4 2 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 3 9 . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 X 6 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

So white has to pause to capture black 3 with 8, and black gets another move to save his corner:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O X X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O O 1 5 . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O 4 2 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O C 8 . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 X 6 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Having reached the edge of the board, white tries to use it to make an eye:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O X X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O O 1 5 . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O 4 2 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O C 8 . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 X 6 . 0 . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Normally, black could prevent an eye here:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O X X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O O X X . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O . O X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O . O . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . O . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X . . 4 1 2 . 3 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

But 2 threatens to connect underneath, so white gets the second eye - and the game.

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #166 Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 8:34 pm 
Tengen
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In my previous post, I explained why I didn't choose a particular losing move. In this post, I endeavor to explain how that realization led me to the best move - and probably the only move that does not lose.

I that previous post, we were looking at this position:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O 7 5 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Move 7 is heavy. It does not increase the liberties of anything, and it attempts to save a stone that does not have to be saved - D7 either has to be saved OR rendered useless as an eye.

I was looking at this position, dismayed that such a vulgar move was necessary. I started doing sort of tewari analysis, asking myself where other stones should be to make 7 less ugly.

Making D7 a false eye without having to save it would be far more elegant. That, of course, means getting two of the four diagonal neighboring points.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm1 I need two of the circled points
$$ . . . . . . .
$$ . . C O C . .
$$ . . O . O . .
$$ . . C O C . .
$$ . . . . . . .[/go]


In other words, once he plays 4, I don't want a stone at 'a'; I want it at 'b'. If I can hold both 5 and 'b', then D7 becomes a false eye if he captures it.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . b . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 a . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 5 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

So I concluded that a stone at 5 would work. It attempts to extricate D7 by connecting outward via either 'c' or 'd'. And it does not link it's fate to D7 by connecting solidly.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X . c . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . d . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

If white is really determined to not let D7 escape, then 3 as shown above is in one of the four crucial points to make D7 a false eye. If I haven't wasted a move in the wrong place, I can get a second one of the four.

It looks like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 7 . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O 6 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . 5 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Black either saves D7 by killing 4, or makes it a false eye by connecting 7 eastward.

It was this line of thought - with a lot of useless side branches - that led me to choose E6.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #167 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 5:00 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 145
Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk, (GMT+07:00)
Liked others: 1
Was liked: 14
KGS: 2k
IGS: 4k
DGS: 3d
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Universal go server handle: tegais
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #168 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:15 am 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4892
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Kaya handle: Test
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 5 . X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Joaz Banbeck wrote:
... My groups will be hanging on by their fingernails.
I hope nobody slips. There is no room for error here.


Everything is still hanging together here.

His strongest play is to connect at 6 and let me connect at 7:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 5 7 X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O B 4 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Now D7 and :b3: are both in danger. I can save only one of them. When he captures the other, it is a false eye - I think.

If he captures D7, it appears to be fairly simple:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 I save E6, and improve my resistance to the D3 cut.
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O B O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . 2 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X 3 5 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 6 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

So he will probably go with the other capture at E6:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . 1 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Here is where white must complicate. If he goes for the immediate capture, black plays the solid move at 4:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | C O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . C 2 X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O 3 X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O C 1 C . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 4 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


And now all white's eyes are at risk if black plays the circled points.

Thus white must try some complication like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . 1 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . 3 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

or this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . 1 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 6 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X 3 5 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I don't have time to show all of the lines that I have looked at, but so far I cannot find one that works for white.

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #169 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:21 am 
Tengen
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Posts: 4892
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Liked others: 778
Was liked: 1155
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Kaya handle: Test
Triggers:


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 5 7 X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 5 6 X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #170 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 9:17 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 145
Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk, (GMT+07:00)
Liked others: 1
Was liked: 14
KGS: 2k
IGS: 4k
DGS: 3d
OGS: 3d
Universal go server handle: tegais
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 5 7 X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . 8 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I hoped for something like this. After :w9: Black don't have time to make two eyes with B1.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . 1 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 6 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X 3 5 . 9 . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 8 4 7 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


But I'm afraid Black can give up the D4 stone now
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: :b3:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O 8 X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . 1 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 7 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X 3 5 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 6 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline
 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #171 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 12:53 pm 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4892
Location: Banbeck Vale
Liked others: 778
Was liked: 1155
Rank: 1D AGA
GD Posts: 1512
Kaya handle: Test
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 9 5 7 X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . 8 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X . . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

A third time in this corner he chooses the most complicated line, thus giving me the greatest opportunity to make a mistake.

Generally, a player who believes that he has the upper hand wants to simplify matters so as to not loose his advantage in an oversight. Conversely, a player who believes that he is at a disadvantage wants to give his opponent maximum chance to fail - even if he knows that he himself may fall into a pit, for he is no worse off if he does.

I infer from this repeated choice of complicated lines that my opponent thinks that he is in a losing position. ( Although logic compels me to admit that he may have found a winning line that just happens to be at the end of a series of junctures, and the most complicated choice at each of those junctures just happens to lead to the one winning result. )

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #172 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:09 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 145
Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk, (GMT+07:00)
Liked others: 1
Was liked: 14
KGS: 2k
IGS: 4k
DGS: 3d
OGS: 3d
Universal go server handle: tegais
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm101 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 9 5 7 X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X 4 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . 3 2 . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | 1 X O . 8 . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X 0 . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #173 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:23 pm 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4892
Location: Banbeck Vale
Liked others: 778
Was liked: 1155
Rank: 1D AGA
GD Posts: 1512
Kaya handle: Test
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O . . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Triggers:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 2 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X C 3 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 3 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 2 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 . . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #174 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:56 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 145
Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk, (GMT+07:00)
Liked others: 1
Was liked: 14
KGS: 2k
IGS: 4k
DGS: 3d
OGS: 3d
Universal go server handle: tegais
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 3 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 2 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 4 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Like this I'm about 15 points behind in my count. The embarrassing thing is that I die in gote.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X X X 4 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O O . 3 . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 2 X 1 . . 5 X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . 6 . . . . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #175 Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 11:25 pm 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4892
Location: Banbeck Vale
Liked others: 778
Was liked: 1155
Rank: 1D AGA
GD Posts: 1512
Kaya handle: Test
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 3 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 2 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 1 4 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I'm playing the most resilient corner shape that I can. He can't go for the vital point because he dies first:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 3 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 2 . . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 1 4 7 . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #176 Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 8:14 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 145
Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk, (GMT+07:00)
Liked others: 1
Was liked: 14
KGS: 2k
IGS: 4k
DGS: 3d
OGS: 3d
Universal go server handle: tegais
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 3 X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 2 . 6 . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 1 4 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #177 Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 8:43 am 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4892
Location: Banbeck Vale
Liked others: 778
Was liked: 1155
Rank: 1D AGA
GD Posts: 1512
Kaya handle: Test
*Screeeech* ...Wait...what??

I expected this:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . ? ? . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . ? ? X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . ? ? . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 3 X 6 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 2 7 . . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 1 4 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

White 16 forces black 17, otherwise black's three stones get into trouble. Then white plays 18 somewhere in the shaded area.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 3 X 7 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 2 . 6 . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 1 4 . . . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I don't mind an opportunity to extricate my three stones.

And he still can't win a liberties race against my corner:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X X X X . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O O 2 O . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O 3 4 . X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #178 Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 11:56 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 145
Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk, (GMT+07:00)
Liked others: 1
Was liked: 14
KGS: 2k
IGS: 4k
DGS: 3d
OGS: 3d
Universal go server handle: tegais
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 3 X 7 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 2 . 6 . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 1 4 . . 8 X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #179 Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 2:08 am 
Lives in sente

Posts: 1310
Location: Finland
Liked others: 42
Was liked: 116
Rank: FGA 7k GoR 1297
TegaiS wrote:
Like this I'm about 15 points behind in my count. The embarrassing thing is that I die in gote.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X X X 4 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O O . 3 . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 2 X 1 . . 5 X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . 6 . . . . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Is :b6: needed? Can't black play this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X X X X . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O O . O . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


And still capture E2 group before white can kill black corner?

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 Post subject: Re: #264 Joaz Banbeck vs TegaiS
Post #180 Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 2:22 pm 
Tengen
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm111 Prisoners: :b3: :w1:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . O X . O X . . |
$$ | . X . X X . X X O , . O . O O , . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O . . O . . . O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | O O O X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X X O . X O . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | X X O . O . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O O X 3 X 7 . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | X X X O 2 . 6 . X X . O . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 1 4 . . 8 X O O . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . 9 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I don't see where he is going with this. As long as I can kill this group faster than white can kill my corner, I'm OK.
My move preserves my lead in the liberties race. And it prevents the connection underneath. So it can't be bad, right?


White must see that he can't get eyes in a space that small. And he also must have read the same liberties race that I have and come to the same conclusion. So where is he going with this sacrifice?

The only thing this does for white is that it lets him pressure the line of four black stones at D4/G4. He removes liberties on the underside by creating this group. It looks like it might last long enough to let the white stones on the upper side attack the four black stones from the top - and thereby get enough sente moves to make an extra eye.

I've looked at that possibility a lot. And it doesn't work. The four black stones are always one move ahead in a liberties race, or able to connect eastward.

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