| Life In 19x19 http://lifein19x19.com/ |
|
| #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) http://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=7021 |
Page 1 of 13 |
| Author: | topazg [ Mon Oct 22, 2012 2:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
Ok, glutton for punishment is back up again.
I'm black, it's no komi, otherwise normal Japanese type rules and everything I think. On the plus side: my last couple of games have been disappointing by my commenting standards, so I'll try a bit harder this time (hmmm, I said that last time too) On the down side: my life is completely upside down right now, so I don't promise a high move rate. |
|
| Author: | EdLee [ Mon Oct 22, 2012 2:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
|
|
|
| Author: | Splatted [ Mon Oct 22, 2012 2:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
I'm looking forward to this. 
|
|
| Author: | Magicwand [ Mon Oct 22, 2012 4:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
when you play a game with someone for the first time it is much harder for a stronger players to overpower weaker players. but after few game weaker players know that they are weaker and play timidly. Stronger players knows exactly howmuch overplay is needed. this game i will try to comment much as possible and try to not to overplay. |
|
| Author: | topazg [ Mon Oct 22, 2012 4:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
I forgot to say magicwand, good luck and have a great game Me, playing the same old thing?? Never! |
|
| Author: | Magicwand [ Mon Oct 22, 2012 4:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
|
|
| Author: | Magicwand [ Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
everyone already knows that i only play double star point when i am white. below is what i expect from my opponent and white a or b. probably b since it is not even game.
|
|
| Author: | topazg [ Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
For beginners: |
|
| Author: | Magicwand [ Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:58 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
N4 takin slow approach. Dont need any complications |
|
| Author: | topazg [ Tue Oct 23, 2012 5:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
Normal normal For beginners:  may look like an odd approach, but the basic premise is that it prevents one of Black's goals (being to set up a framework based on extending and completing some of his shapes like this):
As a result, an approach in either right side corner is fairly typical, simply as a combined preventative strategy and development strategy for White. The idea here is to allow Black the corner in exchange for giving White more development potential at the bottom. The following is a very common continuation:
White makes the beginning of his own framework on the lower side, Black mostly completes his corner, and then takes the bit point at the top for his own extension. If White pincers with "a", I'll be looking to take the corner, if White pulls back with "b" or "c", I'll take the large high extension to be consistent with building this whole framework thing. |
|
| Author: | Magicwand [ Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
normal fuseki. but somehow i dont like it. My opponent is very skilled in non contact fuseki. Soon I will start complicate the game a bit. i expect my opponent to knight move approach to upper left corner. |
|
| Author: | topazg [ Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
|
|
| Author: | Magicwand [ Tue Oct 23, 2012 11:59 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
|
|
| Author: | topazg [ Tue Oct 23, 2012 12:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
We're playin' big - let me guess, there's a fight going to decide this game again .. For beginners: I feel White's move makes some sense. With the position White now has on the lower side, pulling back like this allows White a nice continuation on the left side:
Here, it feels like White has good chances on building a large framework, and getting the potential for a large amount of points is a bit more of a priority without komi. Of course, Black is similarly aiming towards a large framework, and sliding into the corner feels contrary to the opening so far:
With  and  low, it feels like Black is a bit flat and not making the most of the development potential that the 4-4 in the top right gives to the upper side of the board. The joseki with  at "a" seems a bit poor for White for two reasons (see next dia), but I think White's happy enough to block here that this becomes largely irrelevant.
Not only does the ladder with  not work for White, but because the marked White stone is high, Black can jump as far as "b" to further reduce White's position. I don't think White can be happy with this situation.So, regarding the game move, playing the high 3 space jump works to increase the framework size in the top right (and prevents the O17 approach from having a two space extension along the top) - the invasion isn't a particularly great risk right now, because Black can simply take the corner for reasonable profit:
Sometimes Black can exchange "a" for "b" first, but White has some complicated resistances to this, so I tend not to unless that extra outside move is really clearly very valuable. |
|
| Author: | Magicwand [ Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
playing on the side will make this game too simple. I am down 6.5 points and making it simple is nogo. My move above will create some more complications that will add some more variance to the game result. |
|
| Author: | topazg [ Thu Oct 25, 2012 4:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
Ok, this was a kind of complicated decision to make. In many ways, coming across the top of my stone like this feels like a good move played a bit early, but it's only early if I can really do something about it. As I showed in the beginner section on the previous move, if White dives in at H17 Black has no problem living in the corner, so the first instinct is simply to ignore White and wedge on the left hand side. However:
 no longer needs to be at "a" to prevent Black from connecting up now (if Black cuts at "a", White connects at "b"). As a result, I'm finding it hard to see a way of getting adequate compensation for what could conceivably be a very large loss in the corner. The wedge is valuable, but it doesn't feel like it is big enough for this exchange. I did consider wedging with , allowing  , and then aiming at moves like "c" to either make a good left hand side or get stuck into the corner (even the marked Black stone has some decent aji left), but it just didn't feel comfortable. So, as a result, I decided to secure the position at the top, leave a pretty much sente slide into the corner for later, and hope to get a chance to wedge on the next move. |
|
| Author: | Magicwand [ Thu Oct 25, 2012 4:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
playing chicken game.. i dont like this kinda game but...result should be same. |
|
| Author: | Bill Spight [ Thu Oct 25, 2012 5:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
Will  be the reply? My guess is a. |
|
| Author: | topazg [ Fri Oct 26, 2012 3:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
I've updated my comment on the last move with a bit of further reasoning So, time to wedge I think. Black's still ahead on the top side, so there's no great rush, and Black can't easily be pressed back down to the third line up there just yet. I really wanted to wedge high, but to be honest, I felt it was too hard to stabilise with a base if White simply approached:
This sort of thing might be ok-ish, but it feels icky. White's top left is expanding too nicely, and even if the slide at "a" isn't a problem, it's pretty much sente and continues the "exchange" of points in White's direction on the left hand side. My concern about playing low is that White will be able to build up a bit of a framework - maybe something like this:
However, not only does the corner have to be dealt with first, but the framework feels a bit ... thin, even if  was at "a". So, for the time being, I'll look at making a nice stable group and bide my time. I'm expecting a top right corner approach move at "c" soon.For beginners:
is a common wedge point because a two space jump (marked with "a" and "b") is available on each side - the idea being, if White approaches it from either direction, Black can make the beginnings of a settled base in the other. Sometimes this sort of thing isn't possible ... in which case, in a situation like this, I'd aim closer towards "a", so I'd have a choice of following up with or diving into the corner with "c" |
|
| Author: | Bonobo [ Fri Oct 26, 2012 4:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: #181 magicwand vs topazg (again!) |
topazg, I really like your “for beginners” comments, thank you! |
|
| Page 1 of 13 | All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ] |
| Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |
|