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Offline Annihilist
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #81 Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 1:43 am 
Lives with ko
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Posts: 161
Liked others: 26
Was liked: 18
Rank: KGS 10 kyu
KGS: Annihilist
IGS: Annihilist
DGS: Ubermensch
Kaya handle: Annihilist
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X 7 . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Solid connection with the intent of splitting his groups, also leaving him with a weak stone on the right.
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Offline otenki
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #82 Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:18 am 
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Posts: 415
Location: Antwerp, Belgium
Liked others: 43
Was liked: 32
Rank: EGF 2k
Universal go server handle: tygempanda
I'm still fully enjoying this game, how about you ? Tell me if and when it should start to become boring.

Cheers,
Otenki

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X 7 . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



Feels kind of slow but I want to keep connected in order to attack with a decent group or invade the right side later.
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Offline Amelia
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #83 Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:58 am 
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Posts: 238
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 109
Rank: 10k
KGS: Soji
DGS: Soji
Online playing schedule: KGS usually Friday 20:00-23:00
Otenki (Beginner's question)

How do you feel about your initial plan? Is it working the way you hoped it would and why?
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Offline Annihilist
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #84 Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 5:36 pm 
Lives with ko
User avatar

Posts: 161
Liked others: 26
Was liked: 18
Rank: KGS 10 kyu
KGS: Annihilist
IGS: Annihilist
DGS: Ubermensch
Kaya handle: Annihilist
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X X . 9 . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Lets keep him sealed in. I assumed he'd play one line up (first line) to keep him connected.

Edit: Just noticed a weakness in his shape:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm1 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 5 O 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O 4 X X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


And if he plays this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm1 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 4 O 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 3 O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O 6 X X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Either capturing race, or connect and die. At least, that's how it looks.

Couple of whole board points I should play at some point:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X X . 9 . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . c . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . a . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . d . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . b . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . e . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


a: Been through this before. I really want to play it, and I think if he does he can make big gains
b: This is good after one of us plays a. If he does, I can sneak under and reduce his territory. I'd say a and b are almost miai - almost, not quite.
c: not sure if this is good or not. Need to read into it more.
d: Same, but this looks more promising. It limits development of his group.
e: Going off a limb here, but I wonder if I can save this group. Evidently failed invasion, and I know what my mistake was, but I'm not giving up yet.
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Offline otenki
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #85 Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:20 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 415
Location: Antwerp, Belgium
Liked others: 43
Was liked: 32
Rank: EGF 2k
Universal go server handle: tygempanda
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O 0 X X . 9 . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Fix shape and get ready to fight. :rambo:


@Amelia: I'll answer your question later.
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Offline Annihilist
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #86 Posted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 6:00 pm 
Lives with ko
User avatar

Posts: 161
Liked others: 26
Was liked: 18
Rank: KGS 10 kyu
KGS: Annihilist
IGS: Annihilist
DGS: Ubermensch
Kaya handle: Annihilist
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I wanted to do this for a while.
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Offline otenki
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #87 Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:24 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 415
Location: Antwerp, Belgium
Liked others: 43
Was liked: 32
Rank: EGF 2k
Universal go server handle: tygempanda
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Amelia, I'll try to answer your question now also:

Black is playing quite well for a 10kyu kgs. Of course since this is a game in which both of us have lots of time to read the
difference in reading strength is not visible. Nevertheless black is doing great.

Howhever lets talk about positional judgment. What do you percieve this board like ?
My first responce is to be VERY afraid of being white on this board.
Black seems to have a huge moyo which can turn into a lot of points.

Howhever now that I look more objective I see that his moyo has lots of problems.
I'll get to them as I describe my next move.

Now lets look at white. White has a small moyo as well and some power on the lower right.
White's moyo is also full of problems. Because of the aji of the not so dead stones in the lower left black has lots of ways to reduce this allready small moyo of white.

That sucks :-)

So what can we do ?

- Fix own problems (big, no more reduction from black)
- Attack blacks weaknesses. (very big but very hard to do if you have my reading skills :-) )
- Create aji that will allow us to invade/reduce blacks moyo later. (very big but really needs to be sente so a bit risky)

So I'll try to attack blacks weaknesses and invade this way.

Maybe I can lean on the left side to attack the top:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O 7 X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X 6 , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 8 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 4 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X 3 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Howhever the left side becomes soooo strong which is bad for my own moyo.
If black now starts attacking my left side, the game will be very hard.

How about the other way around ?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O 5 X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X 4 , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 3 . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 8 . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This might work but I'm not sure he will play this way.
Maybe he will just push instead:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O 5 X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X 4 , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 3 . . 8 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 7 . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . 9 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


2 feels a bit wrong though, lets try a bit further...
Its too close to black and too many stronger players have told me not to do this.
I usualy also play with better results if I don't so I won't.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O 7 X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X 6 , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 4 . 0 . 8 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 . 2 . 9 . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



Now a complex fight starts. I haven't read out what could happen in all the scenarios but I think I like this.
I realize this is a dangerous move because it can be cut, however I think there is plenty of aji for doing something there.

I'll play 2 and see what happens.
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Offline Annihilist
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #88 Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:31 pm 
Lives with ko
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Rank: KGS 10 kyu
KGS: Annihilist
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Kaya handle: Annihilist
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I expected this kind of move. So I'm going to threaten to break into his corner.

I also considered this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 4 2 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Or something similar, not sure how accurate my reading is here. But I can play this move next.
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Offline Uberdude
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #89 Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:33 pm 
Judan

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@Annihilist

Annihilist wrote:
But I can play this move next.


Are you forgetting that in Go the players take turns, so unless white passes he may play a move which means you can't do that move next? ;-)
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Offline Annihilist
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #90 Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:40 pm 
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Uberdude wrote:
@Annihilist

Annihilist wrote:
But I can play this move next.


Are you forgetting that in Go the players take turns, so unless white passes he may play a move which means you can't do that move next? ;-)

Uberdude (+obs)
No. I expect him to descend, to stop me from destroying his corner. Which leaves the same move vacant for me. Of course, he could play that connecting move if he wants. But that leaves him with inefficient shape, and his corner is still open.

One thing I forgot to mention is my move also serves to secure more territory along the left side.
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Offline otenki
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #91 Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 4:08 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 2 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



So I want my stones to stay connected.
I can do it with an empty triangle which is pretty ugly or I can do it with a contact move which makes stronger.

For beginners: shoulder hits are also contact moves. There are indeed not really touching but kindoff demand response.

I guess I'll go for the contact move instead of the bad shape.
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Offline Uberdude
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #92 Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 10:53 am 
Judan

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otenki wrote:
For beginners: shoulder hits are also contact moves. There are indeed not really touching...


Errr, no they aren't as they aren't touching :-?
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Offline Annihilist
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #93 Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:41 pm 
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Argh. I'm slipping. I saw this move, but didn't see it. I can't make enough gains in the corner to justify invading yet.

Will have a move later.
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Offline EdLee
 Post subject:
Post #94 Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:00 pm 
Honinbo
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otenki wrote:
For beginners: shoulder hits are also contact moves. There are indeed not really touching but...
If we define "touch" and "contact" to mean "to share one liberty with,"
then a shoulder hit in Go is not a touching or contact move.

However, in the normal English sense, it's not so easy to imagine
a non-touching, non-contact shoulder hit ? :)
Attachment:
shoulder_hit.jpg
shoulder_hit.jpg [ 90.08 KiB | Viewed 8305 times ]

This post by EdLee was liked by: Akura
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Offline jts
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #95 Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:41 pm 
Oza
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I think it's a semantic distinction. I've seen books define a shoulder hit as a contact move, on the grounds that after another stone is added, there will be two stones next to one stone.
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Offline Annihilist
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #96 Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:43 pm 
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I think it's *effectively* a contact move - keyword "effectively". Because while it does not physically contact the other stone, it does have the effect of a contact move, especially if the other player reacts with a stretch, in which case the position is identical. At least, that's what I heard.
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Offline otenki
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #97 Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 3:22 am 
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Hey Annihilist,

I was wondering if you were still playing this malkovich.
If not, just let me know.

Otherwise I'll be waiting for your next move :-)

Cheers,
Otenki
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Offline Annihilist
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #98 Posted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:08 am 
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Yes I am, sorry I've been quite busy recently.
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Offline Annihilist
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #99 Posted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:08 pm 
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Rank: KGS 10 kyu
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Sorry about that. Life happened, lots of personal stuff got in the way.

This seems reasonable. I threaten to cut of his stones if he doesn't connect.

I'm tempted to try yet another invasion down the bottom, but I really can't tell yet how that would work out.
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Offline otenki
 Post subject: Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki
Post #100 Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:12 am 
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Hey,

Sorry but I feel I cannot put enough time into this game in order to make it useful anymore.
A few other priorities have come up in my life and I just can't get the time in for the next 7 month.
I want to thank you for the game; good one.

Sorry.

Cheers,
Otenki
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