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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #61 Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 7:04 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 241
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Rank: EGF 1 dan
Universal go server handle: TIM82
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm41
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . 1 . O . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Thanks for the bumb, and apologies for silence. First I did 10h+ days on home renovation for about two weeks and then turned to total carefree holiday mode as a result... But I should have left you a note about being busy at least.

I'm travelling until the end of the month, so moves wont be that frequent, but hopefully more so than before.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #62 Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 2:53 pm 
Oza

Posts: 2461
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Universal go server handle: skydyr
Online playing schedule: When my wife is out.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm41
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . 1 . O . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I'm okay with leaving a bit more aji behind in exchange for limiting white's eyespace, as my game plan from here is predicated on building a decent center by chasing this and then taking a big point.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #63 Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 5:21 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 241
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Rank: EGF 1 dan
Universal go server handle: TIM82
Online playing schedule: sometimes KGS
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm41
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . 1 . O . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 5 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #64 Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 6:33 am 
Oza

Posts: 2461
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Universal go server handle: skydyr
Online playing schedule: When my wife is out.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm41
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . 1 . O . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . 8 7 5 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

This fixes my weakness to some degree and pokes at his shape. I'm going to need to go back and fix the UR corner at some point soon, but for the moment I don't need to worry because I can kill this group instead if white tenukis.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #65 Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:10 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 241
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Rank: EGF 1 dan
Universal go server handle: TIM82
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm41
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . 1 . O . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . 9 . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . 8 7 5 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I think last black move would have noticeably been better at A or B below - less aji for me, same effect.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm41
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . 1 . O . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . d c . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . 8 7 5 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X a X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . b 4 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I'm ready to sacrifice the three stones in middle right- it seems I get some pressure on black top corner in exchange. Additionally, if I saved them with the tigers mouth connection at c above instead, in my reading black would build a mighty wall and I get nothing after that in a simple oneway street beginning with d above.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #66 Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 12:42 pm 
Oza

Posts: 2461
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Universal go server handle: skydyr
Online playing schedule: When my wife is out.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm41
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . 1 . O 0 . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . 9 . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . 8 7 5 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I originally considered this:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . O 2 O 4 6 . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O 1 3 5 . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


But I didn't like the effect on the corner group. How does black deal with a corner invasion afterwards? I next considered that :b1: and :w2: followed by the game move, but decided that hurt P11 and violates the 1-2-3 principle, so I am playing the game move directly.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #67 Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 1:36 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 241
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Rank: EGF 1 dan
Universal go server handle: TIM82
Online playing schedule: sometimes KGS
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


so bad shape for both of us it is. I am not happy at all with how I handled the right side, but it's not total disaster either.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #68 Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 1:58 pm 
Oza

Posts: 2461
Location: DC
Liked others: 145
Was liked: 435
Universal go server handle: skydyr
Online playing schedule: When my wife is out.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . b . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . a . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I'd like to be able to play A or so directly, but I think that I'll get the corner in trouble and can't read out the connection options completely, so I'm claiming the corner and leaving white with a weak eyeless group between two strong ones.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #69 Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:36 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 241
Liked others: 11
Was liked: 28
Rank: EGF 1 dan
Universal go server handle: TIM82
Online playing schedule: sometimes KGS
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 3 X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Too many options to say how this ends, but the only move shapewise in my opinion.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #70 Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:06 pm 
Oza

Posts: 2461
Location: DC
Liked others: 145
Was liked: 435
Universal go server handle: skydyr
Online playing schedule: When my wife is out.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 3 X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I've been trying to figure out another path for a while, but a hane here seems way too dangerous with the aji of Q10 with Q7. I think I can cut and fight if white pushes along.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #71 Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2014 11:50 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 241
Liked others: 11
Was liked: 28
Rank: EGF 1 dan
Universal go server handle: TIM82
Online playing schedule: sometimes KGS
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 3 X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 4 . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #72 Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 8:50 am 
Oza

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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 3 X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 4 . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Back from the congress now, and things are quieting down, so I hope to play more frequently.
I decided to play solidly, as white owes a move around the cut and black has a lot of bad aji otherwise stemming from the weird double-haneish shape. White still isn't alive, so I should be able to drive him some until he connects or makes eyes.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #73 Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 11:10 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . . . . . 7 . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 3 X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 4 . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Unless I add a move, he will probably resume attack immediately, my shape would be so bad. This :w57: aims also to expand the top side in addition to improving the shape of my stones on right.

Additionally, getting thickness here means that if I get to make moves against black top left group, they will be even more severe. Haven't found a way to deprive that group of two local eyes, but perhaps black will help me by invading around C8 soon? ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #74 Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 1:32 pm 
Oza

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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . 8 . . . 7 . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 3 X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 4 . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

This move is a bit impulsive, as I'm not sure of the direction to go in from here. The cut at N11 works, I believe, but I don't know that it's that effective at this time. My goal is to help weaken white's connection to the topside group a bit by making it easier for me to cut. At the same time, I want to prevent white from leaning on my left side group, threaten to reduce, and also make a future invasion around C8 or C9 more severe. I'm still very unsure of when that invasion should happen, or if I should take the bottom left corner instead. I seriously doubt I will get to do both.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #75 Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 3:25 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . 8 . . . 7 . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 3 X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 4 . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . 9 . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


What's the aim of last move by black? It does not seem to do that much to me - perhaps skydyr will demonstrate otherwise...

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #76 Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 3:44 am 
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[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . 8 . . . 7 . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 3 X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 4 . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . 9 . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


A stab at very rough counting, assuming left side is solved peacefully.

Black:
Top right: 15-20
Right side 20
Top left 5-10
bottom: 15
TOTAL: 55-65

White:
Top 35
Left: 15
bottom: 10
Right: Doesn't die, points are bonus :)
TOTAL: 60+

Assuming I'm not totally off, I've about gotten back the handicap stones. This was my impression before counting. I think I can handle any complications black might try on left, but let's see how it goes.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #77 Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 7:16 am 
Oza

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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . 8 . . . 7 . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 3 X . X O . . |
$$ | . . 0 . . . . . . . . . 5 4 . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . 9 . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Well, my opponent's taken the corner so let's get this fight started before he takes both of the miai. I was tempted to reduce the top and try and cut the right side group off, but I'd prefer to do that through the flow of the fight.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Rough expectations
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . X . . . O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . O . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . 1 . O . . . . . , . . O X . X O . . |
$$ | . . B . . . . . . . . . O X . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . a b c . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I expect this move in response from white, and am thinking about how to proceed, between A, B, and C, which are all fairly normal depending on the circumstances. B leads to a well-known ko. Perhaps rather intuitively, A is territorial and C is influential in aim. I haven't counted ko threats yet, but intend to shortly as I'm not sure if the ko is a good choice for black or not. My inclination is that black's positions are more solid than white's, which should mean that black has more ko threats, but I'll count after my opponent responds, in case he does something odd like attaching on top.

I did consider playing one point lower instead, but regarding the normal joseki in the corner, white's a move ahead and black doesn't have the ladder, so I'm inclined to think it won't come out as well, and it doesn't activate the connection aji as strongly.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #78 Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 7:57 am 
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Universal go server handle: TIM82
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm61
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . X . . . O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . O . . . |
$$ | . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . O X . X O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O X. . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Whatever I do, I must keep :b60: separate from black stones above it. This move puts most pressure on the top group while separating.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #79 Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 8:22 am 
Oza

Posts: 2461
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Universal go server handle: skydyr
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm61
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . X . . . O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . O . . . |
$$ | . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . O X . X O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O X . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm61
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . X . . . O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . O . . . |
$$ | . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . O X . X O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O X . . X X . |
$$ | . 6 7 4 . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . 5 2 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

So this is the ko...
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm61
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . X . . . O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . O . . . |
$$ | . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . 0 . O . . . . . , . . O X . X O . . |
$$ | . 9 X 8 . . . . . . . . O X . . X X . |
$$ | . 6 7 4 . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . 5 2 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

But I think I could play this way if necessary since white played :w51: one space higher, limiting his connection. I'll admit black's group looks kind of heavy, but then, so does white's. I think I'm comfortable playing this way.

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 Post subject: Re: #232 TIM82 vs Skydyr
Post #80 Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:56 am 
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Sorry, will think for a bit longer propably, was a busy weekend.

I kind of ignored the ko-sequence below :oops:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm61
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . X . . . O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . O . . . |
$$ | . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . O X . X O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O X . . X X . |
$$ | . 4 . 6 . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . 3 2 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


It does seem hard to fight that ko right now unless I find some spectacular threats e.g. at bottom. If I could get A below as an attack on the group above it, that would improve the situation with the ko in my reading a lot (I can then surround black if he tries to fight the ko...).
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm61
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X O . . . . . . . . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . X . . . O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . O . O . . . |
$$ | . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . a . . . , . . O X . X O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O X . . X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . X . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . , . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X . . X . . X O O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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