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Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White
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Author:  Zwergesel [ Thu May 27, 2010 7:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Guess I'll join team white!
Hi, everyone! :)

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . . W X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


White obviously doesn't want to get enclosed.

Also this move has already been discussed openly in the previous comments by much stronger players ;-)


edit: Oops, let's try this diagram again!

Author:  topazg [ Thu May 27, 2010 8:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

unkx80 wrote:
How come you guys are discussing moves that haven't been played so openly?


Hem, sorry, you are quite right. For some reason I thought this was a variation that now couldn't be played because it had taken a different path. :oops:

Author:  topazg [ Thu May 27, 2010 8:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Still, having said it, I'm on team Black now:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . B . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Author:  Dusk Eagle [ Thu May 27, 2010 12:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

I feel that learning from these moves is more important than this actual game.

Plus, if I can bait team black to show more sequences than team white does... :twisted:

Author:  Chew Terr [ Thu May 27, 2010 12:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . W X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I guess I haven't taken the helm in a while. Here goes nothing...

Okay, the two options I see are these:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . a X b . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Both seem to end up very similarly.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X 4 . O X 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . 2 X W . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . 2 O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X 4 1 O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . W X 3 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


The second way seems to push black slightly less far south, so it seems preferable.

I feel like we're behind. Are we behind? I guess we're beind on the board because we jumped in to reduce/invade their top side, and we still have our bottom framework intact. I really like the idea of taking somewhere around the west star point ASAP, as it's halfway between our thicknesses. But it seems better not to get shut into the northwest first.

Author:  unkx80 [ Mon Jun 07, 2010 11:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Let me resurrect this long forgotten game...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . B O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I had quite a bit of difficulty deciding whether to atari or not. In the end, I decided to atari.

Author:  k43r [ Mon Jun 07, 2010 11:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . W O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Hi whites!

No brainer

Author:  freegame [ Mon Jun 07, 2010 1:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

I guess I'll play one for black.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . W O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X B . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


preventing the double atari seems like the only option for black.
I selected the solid connection because this avoids bad aji.
Q10 is also in a nice spot giving black quite some solid points on the right.

I did not play at a in the diagram below because playing at a leaves cutting-points
that for example make the marked white (endgame) move dangerous for black.
and it would also leaves some nasty aji behind.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . W O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


next white needs to capture the cutting stone an N15 to avoid giving black huge outside thickness and getting sealed in.
so black gets to keep sente as well, which is nice.

Author:  padic [ Mon Jun 07, 2010 4:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Jumping in on Team White..

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X W X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I see no alternative to this; we can't allow ourselves to be cut off and sealed in.

Author:  freegame [ Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Lets get this game going again.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X W X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


very hard to decide what to play next. something on the bottom or on the right.
I selected the right because this has more support from other black stones. after
white defends at O3 (which seems like a normal move) Black gets sente again, and can still split the bottom.

Author:  Zwergesel [ Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


A pincer is not an option, so I considered the low extension, the high extension and the large low extension. The large low extension is too loose and does not work best with the left side!

For the high extension I was afraid that black might play :b2: which takes away the big side that we have.
Although if black doesn't play there, 'a' would be the perfect spot for white.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . 1 . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . a 2 . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This leaves us with the low extension. If black plays :b2: we can either ignore it or play :w3: to cause complications. If he plays elsewhere :w2: is a big corner for us which also aims at :w3: too.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Author:  Jonas [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 12:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Hmmmm I guess team black need reinforcements~ I'm in ;)

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I think Black should play like this:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . 1 O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . 2 . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Author:  Dusk Eagle [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 7:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . W O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Zwergesel: I think our last move should have been high. Yes, black could come in, but that is only to our advantage when we have those three stones on the left. This is still fine though.

Anyway, this move keeps his two groups separated, and leaves us with access to the center.

Author:  Joaz Banbeck [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . O O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . B . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

There is a proverb somethng like "A move on the border of two moyos counts double"
We have a big territory building up on the right side, white has one starting on the bottom. Playing at the border between them accomplishes two things: it surrounds our territory, and it pushes down / invades theirs. One is defensive, one is offensive, thus it is said to be worth double.

Compare the above position with the one below.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . O O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . W . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


My estimate is that the net difference between the two positions is something around 40 points.

BTW, it is sente. It threatens this reduction:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . B . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . 1 . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Author:  Joaz Banbeck [ Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Warning to white:

Your clock has been running for over nine years. You are on the verge - relatively speaking - of losing one of your 10-year byo-yomi periods.

Author:  Kirby [ Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . O O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . X . W X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Author:  Joaz Banbeck [ Fri Jul 24, 2020 4:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Forum Wide Malkovich Game: Black vs. White

After over a year of contemplation, think that the obvious move is indeed the best move.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Prisoners - B:0 W:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . X X O . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O . O O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X O X O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . O O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . X . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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