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 Post subject: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #1 Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:53 pm 
Lives with ko

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My opponent (Black) in this game played a fuseki that I don't encounter very often. Would someone be willing to review this game up to move 52. I'm mainly curious about whether my general approach was reasonable or not. I felt good about it until move 52. At that point, I made the first of what turned out to be a series of serious mistakes resulting in me resigning.



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 Post subject: Re: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #2 Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:13 pm 
Tengen

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Nothing in your opening screams out at me "What are you doing you noob?!". As you said could take empty corners a bit earlier, but being solid against such a centre opening is reasonable. After his 3-3 your c5 hane is maybe a bit risky, did you consider his aggressive cut instead of hane under? Also instead of extend I'd want to double hane. Good job with bottom kill. L5 at k6 is usually better shape, but maybe you actually need the l5 liberties to kill, I didn't read n4 push aji with k6. And yeah just connect is good enough after killing: simplify a game you are leading.


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 Post subject: Re: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #3 Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 7:52 pm 
Judan

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Your play was quite reasonable. A few comments. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #4 Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:05 pm 
Dies in gote

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Uberdude wrote:
Also instead of extend I'd want to double hane.

White gets wall in sente!
I'm not really sure what to play next, but the marked points are what sprung to mind for me. I think this is better than :w5: cutting at 2-4 point to capture the 2 stones because of the wall+sente. In addition, the black stone on the middle left would seem poorly placed and inefficient.

The extend was also good I think, but I just didn't like that your opponent had sente to reduce your lower side.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . c . . X . . . . X . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . d . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 6 1 2 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . B O 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . , . . . . . O . X . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . a . . . O . . b . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


EDIT 1: Now that I think about it, I kind of like the extension on the star point instead. It feels like it would work better with the position on the right.
EDIT 2: Leela thinks :w5: cutting at 2-4 point is better :sad:


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 Post subject: Re: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #5 Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 4:30 am 
Tengen

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WindCaliber wrote:
Uberdude wrote:
Also instead of extend I'd want to double hane.

White gets wall in sente!
EDIT 2: Leela thinks :w5: cutting at 2-4 point is better :sad:


That was my plan: being 100% alive and having some points looks good on this board and makes the black stone on middle left inefficient, building a moyo with a wall which is not alive is riskier (indeed I would want to extend on 4th line either star point or one left, but then later I worry black can invade, won't die, white can't make centre moyo in exchange and may even have to worry about eyes).

In fact with the double hane I would worry a bit about black playing atari and then connecting in the corner: normally bad but here he wants to fight and make use of the side and centre stones (W doesn't have ladder so idea is prevent W from capturing cutting stone and then come back to live with corner as it still needs an extra move).

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc c9 working well, even if W can make some miserable 2nd line connection
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 7 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 5 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 1 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . X O 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 4 X O . . . . . , . . . . . O . X . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc atari to get out, but helps black cutting stones so hurts other side
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 9 5 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 1 2 6 8 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . X O 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 4 X O . . . . . , . . . . . O . X . |
$$ | . . X O . c . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . b 0 a . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


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 Post subject: Re: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #6 Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:18 am 
Judan

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Let's not forget this kind of plan. :)

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . X . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . 2 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . 5 . . . . . O . X . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #7 Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 8:26 am 
Tengen

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Bill, indeed, that's what I implied when I said the c5 hane could be risky if he cuts, but thanks for making a diagram to make it clear. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #8 Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 8:41 am 
Judan

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Uberdude wrote:
Bill, indeed, that's what I implied when I said the c5 hane could be risky if he cuts

Great minds think alike. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #9 Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:53 am 
Tengen

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But fools rarely differ ;-)


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 Post subject: Re: Review Request for Unusual Game
Post #10 Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:34 pm 
Lives with ko

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Uberdude, Bill, and WindCaliber, thank you for such a comprehensive assessment! As always, this was extremely helpful.

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