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 Post subject: A sound spanking
Post #1 Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:35 pm 
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I got creamed on this one. I doubt my opponent is 7k. Or maybe he is actually 7k and my Go skills have become very weak ^^; He plays for influence and I don't know much about playing against influence. As well, my opponent used forceful plays and I should learn how to stay away from early fights, since my opponent seems to get stronger strategically as a result. I didn't receive any handicap in either game.
Here are the 2 games.




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39016755-259-slashpine-Gotty6.sgf [2.69 KiB]
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39017521-267-slashpine-Gotty6.sgf [2.91 KiB]
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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #2 Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 1:13 am 
Gosei
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Probably a sandbagging high kyu player given his game history.

https://online-go.com/player/1069812/Gotty6

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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #3 Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 1:29 am 
Gosei
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Anyway the first move that I found questionable in your first game is move 32:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Position at move 32
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X X X . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . O . X O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , a X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . b W . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This leaves two cutting points "a" and "b". Locally, a move at "b" instead would be a better shape. Let Black crawl a bit on the second line and then attack the other group.

In your second game, move 80 doesn't look good.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$ Position at move 80
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . X . . X . . . . O . O . |
$$ | . O O X X X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . X . O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . W . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O X X . O . O . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . O . X O . . a . . . . . X O X . |
$$ | . . O , O O X X . , . . . . . X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . b X . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O O . . |
$$ | . X O . O . O . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . O . X O O X . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . X X X . X |
$$ | . . . . X X X . . O . . . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Your group is in danger, it seems you want to make eyeshape but this move just aims at living locally without any followup. I think that a move at "a" to escape towards your friends, threatening a cut at "b", would be a better direction.

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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #4 Posted: Sun Nov 28, 2021 2:01 pm 
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Love how polite and friendly you are playing online. Even when the guy is not answering. Kudos to you and good attitude to be grateful to play a stronger player instead of being mad by being "cheated" by a sandbagger. Keep that positive attitude :)
I'm about a 6-7 kyu on OGS, I'm on GMT+1 timezone. I don't play often anymore, but if you ever wanna play a game together, send me a message!

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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #5 Posted: Sun Nov 28, 2021 3:29 pm 
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jlt wrote:
Probably a sandbagging high kyu player given his game history.

https://online-go.com/player/1069812/Gotty6
I got a look and he hasn't been there long. Might be around 4k in strength since 1 loss against a 5k is recorded.

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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #6 Posted: Sun Nov 28, 2021 3:35 pm 
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Ian Butler wrote:
Love how polite and friendly you are playing online. Even when the guy is not answering. Kudos to you and good attitude to be grateful to play a stronger player instead of being mad by being "cheated" by a sandbagger. Keep that positive attitude :)
To be honest, I was very upset at having lost to a 7k, only to realize later that my opponent can't be that weak. His play was much better than that of the 7k players I usually see on OGS. Even so, it's an odd privilege to play against a sandbagger; your ego definitely takes a hit, but at the same time you get something worth analyzing.

Quote:
I'm about a 6-7 kyu on OGS, I'm on GMT+1 timezone. I don't play often anymore, but if you ever wanna play a game together, send me a message!
It would be a pleasure to play against you one of these days.

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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #7 Posted: Sun Nov 28, 2021 3:38 pm 
Gosei
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I can't see the loss against a 5k, I only see losses by time, or games that were resigned for no reason. I don't see your game either, maybe he set the game as private. Anyway his real level is not important, what is quite sure is that he is significantly stronger than 7k and you shouldn't feel bad being crushed by him.

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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #8 Posted: Sun Nov 28, 2021 5:24 pm 
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A 9 kyu played a 7 kyu and lost two games, why are we talking about sandbagging? I don't understand.

In the first game, the reason for the loss is that white played a very complicated joseki and it didn't go very well. At that point white could have cut his losses but instead tried to trick the opponent and even played out a ladder that didn't work. It happens to everyone but some games are meant to be resigned early.

In the second game, the reason for the loss (or the beginning of white's trouble) is that white tried to make a group in every part of the board. By move 30 there are 5 white groups, by move 50 there are 6, and at one point there are 8 white groups (two of them are already dead). It is almost effortless for black who just seems to be taking care of his own group's until white self-destructed. Black failed to kill white at move 113, which is indicative of how relaxed black is. Black also made a very funny move once it was really all over.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Black to play. You are sandbagger if you can't see it.
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . X . . X . . . . O . O . |
$$ | . O O X X X . . X , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . X X . X X O O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . O . O O X . . X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O X X O O . O X O . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . O X X O O O X O . . . . X O X . |
$$ | . . O , O O X X X X O . O . . X O O . |
$$ | . O O O O X X O O O O . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . X X X O X O O X X X X X O . . . O . |
$$ | . . . X X O X X O O O . . O . O O . . |
$$ | . X O O O . O X X X . X . . . . . O . |
$$ | . X X O . . . X . . . . O . X O O X . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . X X X . X |
$$ | . . . . X X X . . O . . . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


It is not so unusual to self-destruct when playing, especially when playing for fun online. I probably self-destruct once every 10-20 games myself. It is just part of the experience, just try not feel too bad about it.

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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #9 Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2021 12:00 am 
Gosei
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I know he didn't see the atari (this happens) and that besides he made kyu mistakes but look at the game history:

* first 3 games lost by resignation or timeout while being ahead by more than 40 points.
* then 21 wins
* then 1 game lost by resignation while being ahead by more than 40 points.
* then 4 wins
* then 1 game lost by timeout while being slightly ahead.
* then 7 wins.
* the last 8 games on the list are unranked (did he want to avoid ranking up?).
* the games mentioned by OP do not appear on the list so they have been set as private (did he want to hide the fact that his winrate is too high?)

So I still think that he is a 2-3k (?) purposely deflating his rank.

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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #10 Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2021 1:39 am 
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jlt wrote:
I know he didn't see the atari (this happens) and that besides he made kyu mistakes but look at the game history:

* first 3 games lost by resignation or timeout while being ahead by more than 40 points.
* then 21 wins
* then 1 game lost by resignation while being ahead by more than 40 points.
* then 4 wins
* then 1 game lost by timeout while being slightly ahead.
* then 7 wins.
* the last 8 games on the list are unranked (did he want to avoid ranking up?).
* the games mentioned by OP do not appear on the list so they have been set as private (did he want to hide the fact that his winrate is too high?)

So I still think that he is a 2-3k (?) purposely deflating his rank.


OK. He sure does seem to win every game and I wouldn't be surprised if he is also playing incredibly fast judging from how long the games take and that there are almost 30 games on the same day. I browsed a few games, I mean this guy could be a dan player judging from some games and a 5 kyu from other games but he never drops a game like you point out. So I guess you are right he is a sandbagger.

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 Post subject: Re: A sound spanking
Post #11 Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 2:57 am 
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