Hello everyone! Nice to meet you New here to the forums (though I did register a little over a year ago), and thought that having my very own thread on Go would help me focus better (a persistent problem which needs to be vanquished!) and maybe even a few words from the community to point me in the right direction too.

Some background: I discovered the game of Go sometime during the winter of 2008 while I was living in Hokkaido. I did not know what the rules were or even what the game was about, but standing near a table momentarily watching over someones shoulder as they placed their stones... it looked oh-so fantastic. Such geometry! I wanted to learn how to play and to understand what was going on, though it would take me nearly half a decade!! before I actually sat down and did anything about it. I am currently in my third year of a physics degree, so my time for Go is somewhat limited unfortunately. However I will do what I can. My experience is a single solitary year of experience consisting of mere short packets of "real" playing and learning, probably clocking in at around half to one month total learning/playing during that year. Until now, I have only studied some Tsumego (via the Android app Tsumego Pro). So no Fuseki or anything like that. Yet. Maybe soonish.

So here I am, now posting my first message on lifein19x19. This is not a study journal chronicling my long journey to shodan or any such thing. I will try progress naturally with no goal in mind. It's simply to help me improve my understanding and quality of game

Edit: I will be posting a game tonight or tomorrow, just for the sake of having a starting point on here so that I may see any progress (hopefully progress anyway).

2nd edit:

Here we go, one lost game as ordered! I think I was a little too aggressive and played too many contact stones. I was also a bit nervous because I knew this game would go on here for all to see. But he was a nice guy and fun to play with. Oh well =]



I realise that I could have lived in the top left and possibly surround that group. I also know that I should have defended some of my corners before he did those numerous invasions :/

In general you learn more from reviewing your losses. I don't have much interest in commenting on you beating an easy AI

I agree fully with that

Tonight or tomorrow I will play until I lose (probably first game hehe), and put it up here. I think I shall remove this first game posted as like you mentioned, it isn't worth much.

Thanks!

In this game, there are a lot of situations that imply that black isn't reading ahead. I recommend for every move that you read three moves ahead... that is, I play here, I expect them to play this or that, and if they play this I'll play over here, and if they play that I'll play there. Three moves isn't very deep, but it's far enough to avoid a lot of the issues with losing important strings of stones.

When you have a set of stones that's cutting the opponent, it's vital that they stay alive, or the cut becomes meaningless and your other stones can be put into a lot of danger once white is strong and connected.

The other takeaway is to make sure your stones stay connected and that white doesn't rip through them without being cut in return. When white cuts through your positions without being cut, it's classic bad shape, as you can only fix one side at a time while each white move attacks both sides.

I agree with skydyr, I think you just need more reading practice. You did well to capture the big white group on the left. But then came this little problem:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm149 How should black play?
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | O . X O . . . . O X X X . . X O . O . |
$$ | . X X O O O O O . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | X X O X X X X X O O O O X . . X O . . |
$$ | X O O O . . . . X X X O X X . . X O . |
$$ | O O O O O . X O X . X O O O X . X O . |
$$ | . O . . . X . X O O X O . . . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . . X O . O X X X . . X . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . X O . O O O O . . . . . |
$$ | O X . , . . X O . O X . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . O X . . X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X X O X . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O 1 . X O X X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O O X O X . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X X O X O O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O O X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . O X . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Before letting that big white chain escape, black had the game well in hand. But even after that mistake I think black still had a good lead (the joy of a handicap!). This next position is a bit harder, but I think if you think about it you can come up with the right move:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm199 How should black play?
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | O O X O . . . . O X X X . . X O . O . |
$$ | . X X O O O O O . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | X X O X X X X X O O O O X . . X O . . |
$$ | X O O O . . . . X X X O X X . . X O . |
$$ | O O O O O . X O X . X O O O X . X O . |
$$ | . O . . . X . X O O X O . O X X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . . X O . O X X X O X X O . |
$$ | X . X . . . . X O . O O O O O . . O . |
$$ | O X . , X . X O . O X . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . O X . . X . . X X X |
$$ | . O O X X O X O O . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O O O O O . O X X . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . X . . O O . O X . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . X X O . O O X . . . . . O X X |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O O X . . . . X X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . O X . . X O O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X . . X O O 1 O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Finding the key move in a position like this will win or lose the game in an instant.

Thanks for the replies! Sorry for replying so late.

Thanks skydyr! I certainly will practise reading at least ahead three moves. I'll try read ahead and keep any groups as strong as I can.

emeraldemon, after looking at the game again, I think the correct response to 149 is:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm149 How should black play?
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | O . X O . . . . O X X X . . X O . O . |
$$ | . X X O O O O O . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | X X O X X X X X O O O O X . . X O . . |
$$ | X O O O . . . . X X X O X X . . X O . |
$$ | O O O O O . X O X . X O O O X . X O . |
$$ | . O . . . X . X O O X O . . . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . . X O . O X X X . . X . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . X O . O O O O . . . . . |
$$ | O X . , . . X O . O X . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . O X . . X 2 . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X X O X . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O 1 . X O X X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O O X O X . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X X O X O O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O O X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . O X . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

For the other problem I think this is a solution? I couldn't see anything else that kept him contained:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm199 How should black play?
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | O O X O . . . . O X X X . . X O . O . |
$$ | . X X O O O O O . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | X X O X X X X X O O O O X . . X O . . |
$$ | X O O O . . . . X X X O X X . . X O . |
$$ | O O O O O . X O X . X O O O X . X O . |
$$ | . O . . . X . X O O X O . O X X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . . X O . O X X X O X X O . |
$$ | X . X . . . . X O . O O O O O . . O . |
$$ | O X . , X . X O . O X . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . O X . . X . . X X X |
$$ | . O O X X O X O O . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O O O O O . O X X . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . X . . O O . O X . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . X X O . O O X . . . . . O X X |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O O X . . . 2 X X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . O X . . X O O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X . . X O O 1 O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Today I managed to get in three games in (while I should have been working haha). Unfortunately they were all [?] ranked opponents, which after playing them seems like it means that they are new players? I won all three though I do not feel like I learned anything apart from playing against a handicap (my first time). I tried to remember to read three moves ahead always, but found it really easy to forget that when your opponent is playing fast. This resulted in making too many careless mistakes.

Perhaps I should adjust the automatch settings in KGS so that I get less [?] opponents somehow. Any suggestions how to do this?

It's not a problem that your opponents might be unranked.

Once they play enough rated games to get ranked, you'll get credit for winning or losing against someone of that rank.

It's a fairly convoluted system.

If you really hate it anyway, you can actually set the automatcher to give only rated opponents, though. It's the second item on the "play go" menu.

Yup, those were the moves of course it's always easier to see afterwards, the hard part is noticing in the game. Keep playing and you will improve rapidly.

Thanks tentano! I'll just leave it the way it is then. It's a bit of a strange system

Thanks =D Will keep on playing emeraldemon. My main goal for now is just to learn to spot silly moves, hopefully during the game but at the very least afterwards while reviewing.



Played a fair few games yesterday to make up for little to no playing today and possibly tomorrow. The game attached was was the last of the night. I made a couple of silly mistakes (should hopefully be in the comments), though I found how to capture some stones in a particular way (and avoid it)

The last four moves are a bit wild. They don't work together at all, and especially Q6 is very self-defeating. There are now four solitary white stones for black to harass. You might want to read something like Otake Hideo's "Opening Theory Made Easy" to get a general feel for it.
The standard move here is R5 or R7. It gets you into a fight, but that's the fun part.
P7 is better, here. If black plays P6 after, maybe you get into a fight, but playing P6 yourself is surrendering.
A little bit like
This is fine, but you should have done more to run out at some point.
Your invasion is alive, but N13 is threatening to shut in that group in the middle.
Yeah, that would have been better.
+100:
This move is pretty good. Poke deep into black territory, instead of defending a few points.
Connect!
+200:
You can play at B11 now.
How about S13?

EDIT:

Hi tentano. Thanks for the feedback, though in the game above I am actually black (mayonnaise) ^^ However I still find moves that my opponent could/should have made just as useful as moves I could/should have made (I try to do this when reviewing games that I played so that I can find any weakness I had but were not exploited). So thank you!

I'll go over this game again tonight in whites shoes, though I doubt I will fit in a new game until tomorrow.

***Edit: Oh, and I definitely have a look at Opening Theory Made Easy. Anything that makes openings easier is perfect! ^^ ***

Hello again everyone! Here is another game that I lost from the other day. I played black in this one. Clocc was a lovely opponent and very friendly

I have pointed out some various moves that I think I should have made, but maybe if someone could tell me better moves that I should have played generally? I am trying to get the feel of how to play a more solid game, as I always leave too many weak spots in order to try gain more territory.

Thanks all! =D

Some comments:

Thanks skydyr! Sorry about the late reply, I have lots on my plate at the moment and little time to handle it.

I'll run through your comments and suggestions tonight as my training

Hello everyone! Here is a game I played yesterday where I take black.

Now I know that I lost this game pretty badly even with a handicap, however I also found it extremely enjoyable. Most fun I had in a while in fact. I was trying to play different from my normal style, I was trying to be more solid (which I unfortunately sacrificed speed for) and leave minimal weaknesses behind. I enjoyed it so will give it a few more tries to get it down before giving up on it

I haven't had a chance to review it yet though I will today sometime, as I already know a few moves that I should and should not have made

Here is some things I think that I could/should have done in game.

Would love some feedback on my general play (am I too slow? Too passive? Too defensive?) If anyone has time of course

Considering that I need to start reading a book or something as just playing isn't going amazing. Heard many good things about "Lessons in the Fundamentals of Go". I think I should also learn some fuseki as I still only know one.

Here's what I could see:

Helpful to white. It's better to play at H14. It puts G14 in atari and threatens a ladder for H15, which doesn't seem to work, but if white then pulls out to G13, you just ask "which of these two?" again by playing at H17. F15 is really a very precarious stone.
D15 catches it
C3 would protect most of that corner.
Was this really worth more than K2?
Q3, seriously. Playing P4 here screams "I HATE CORNER TERRITORY!"
White invades the right side, but black does not care.
White invades the right side, but black does not care.
If they're dead, but you can still make forcing moves, save them until you either have a ko fight, or maybe until you have a very clear idea of how to save
them. Playing it out like that is no use. White becomes more solid and you gain nothing.
Not needed, they're already caught.
Not needed, they're already caught.
White has established a right-side group, essentially without having to fight for it. Yay white! Maybe you shouldn't have ignored it up to now.
+100
O8 catches them.
Q6 is not purely defensive. You'd still threaten to cut off those stones, so white would have to respond to save them. If white plays elsewhere, you could just push in at O9 and they're in trouble.
+200
Not needed, they're already caught.
Not needed, they're already caught. You are aware you can't be cut off at O16, right?
There are still points!
Not yet forced, and there is still a point!

Hope that helps!

Thanks tentano! Gone over all of your comments and saved them into a sgf file. I found them extremely useful

I attempted to translate your advice to an equal game I played this morning but my opponent resigned too early for me to reliably tell if I did it correctly or or not. Will try another game perhaps this evening if I get some free time, otherwise probably Tuesday as Monday I am busy all day.