Dontbtme's Star Point study

Dontbtme · #1

Once upon a Time

First of all, 'Hello there'.
I learnt Go in 2002 but have been stuck at the KGS 2kyu level for quite some time now. Desperate, I stopped playing for a year or two but came back to it six months (?) ago when I discovered the Youtube videos from Dwyrin (Batt) where he plays online while commenting the game. As it happens, Haylee began to do the same about that time, which I think was the start of a Golden Age of sorts for the West Go Community.
Anyway, to shorten my introduction: I came back to Go but still want to make progress, so I'll use this topic to order my recent studies on the Star Point standard sequences.
Feel free to post any thoughts -suggestions, objections, or whatever- you might have.
Ah, and pardon me for my language blunders: hopefully, this thread will also be the occasion for me to improve my English skills.

Dontbtme · #2

The Star Point Corner Stone

Playing on the Star Point is a quick and flexible way to play.
_ Quick because even though an invasion is still possible bellow it (at a), it takes position in the corner with only one move -which is sufficient to limit White's options there.
_ Flexible because it can next develop easily on both sides at b and doesn't need to respond to White's approach at c if there is a more urgent place to play.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$ Quick and Flexible $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . a . . c . . . b . $$ | . . . X . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . c . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . b , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Dontbtme · #3

Black Plays Somewhere Else (part 1/2)

Even if White makes a double approach, Black should be able to manage somehow.
For example, he can lean on White to gain strength.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 1 $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . 7 . 8 1 0 . . . . $$ | . . 9 X . 4 5 . . , . $$ | . . . . . 6 . . . . . $$ | . . 3 . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

If White insists on playing on both sides, Black is still fine.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 2 $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . 5 . . . 4 6 . . . . $$ | . . O . X O 1 . a . . $$ | . 3 2 X . X O . b , . $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W White continues with a or b $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . a . 2 1 O . . . . . $$ | . 8 . X . X O . . , . $$ | . 5 4 . . X . . . . . $$ | . 7 O 6 . . . . . . . $$ | . . . 3 . b . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 3' $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . 2 . . . . . . . $$ | . 1 . X O O 4 . . . . $$ | 3 X . X . X O . . , . $$ | . O X . . X . . . . . $$ | . O O X . . . . . . . $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 3'' $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . X O O . . 3 . . $$ | . X . X . X O . . , . $$ | . O X . . X . . . . . $$ | . O O X . . 2 . . . . $$ | . . . O . 1 . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 4' $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . 7 3 . 5 . . . . $$ | . . 6 1 2 O . . . . . $$ | . . . X 4 X O . . , . $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 4'' $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . 2 1 3 O . . . a . $$ | . 4 . X . X O . . , . $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . b . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Black can also propose some influence to White in exchange for settling down...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$ Double approach 5 $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . 7 . . . . . $$ | . . . . 1 O 5 . . . . $$ | . . . X 3 X O 6 . , . $$ | . . . . . 2 . . . . . $$ | . . O . 4 . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

But White can still play on both sides if she wants to.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W White refuses the exchange $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . 1 . . . . . $$ | . . 5 . X O . . . . . $$ | . . . X X X O . . , . $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . $$ | . . O 2 4 . . . . . . $$ | . . . 3 . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Even so, Black can settle down easily...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$ Double approach 6' $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . 7 . . . . . $$ | . . . . 1 O 5 6 . . . $$ | . . O . X O 3 4 . . . $$ | . . . X X X O . . , . $$ | . 2 . . . O . . . . . $$ | . . O X X . . . . . . $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

... or change his mind and cut through the center.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$ Double approach 6'' $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . $$ | . . . . X O . . . . . $$ | . . . X X X O 2 . , . $$ | . . . . 5 O 1 4 . . . $$ | . . O . . 3 . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Finally, Black doesn't have to touch White to begin with: he can just leave the corner for good and mind his own business somewhere else (again) or develop influence with a. This also keep things very simple.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$ Double approach 7 $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . 2 . . O . . . . . $$ | . . . X . . a . . , . $$ | . . . . 1 . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . a . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Well, that's it for today...
I like the form it's taking. It'll be definitely easier for me to review what I gathered this way than through the sgf files I so painfully made...
And if this could help some kyu players along with me (one can hope), I would be really glad. On the other hand, if you happen to disagree with some of my conclusions, then please say so.

SoDesuNe · #4

Dontbtme wrote:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 2 $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . 5 . . . 4 6 . . . . $$ | . . O . X O 1 . a . . $$ | . 3 2 X . X O . b , . $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

I'm not really big into Joseki, but I remember a different sequence here. Maybe both are possible.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 2 $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . 4 6 . . . . . . . . $$ | . 5 O . X O 1 . . . . $$ | . 3 2 X . X O . . , . $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Dontbtme · #5

You're right. The reason why I didn't pick this one was (I think) because when I consulted Waltheri's go pattern search, it showed this pattern in only 4 modern games (since year 2000) whereas the other one happened in 14.
Some other times I avoided joseki that looked too complicated to me or that seemed not to pursue the starting aim anymore... More on that subject later on, but in short, my approach is to study the straight-forward joseki first and those which I think result of a 'change of plan' (because of the surroundings) last. That wasn't the case in your example, of course, and maybe that was a better choice than mine for a joseki repertoire, I don't know.
What I mean is I made choices for many reasons but they can look completely arbitrary, so whenever someone thinks I let an important joseki aside he/she should post it just like you did.
I'm gonna complete it along with what I found on Josekipedia.
In this sequence, Black doesn't just want to be safe anymore but rather counter-attack White severely which means (I guess) that he has back-up on the top-right. If this is the case, White's connection at 1 was a very aggressive move aiming to start a fight.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 2'' $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . 4 6 . . . . . . . . $$ | . 5 O . X O 1 . . . . $$ | . 3 2 X . X O . . 0 . $$ | . . . . . X 7 . . . . $$ | . . O . . 8 . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . 9 . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Dontbtme · #6

Black Plays Somewhere Else (part 2/2)

When White isn't really interested in playing on both sides, she can make her second approach high (and treat it lightly) to help developing the first one.
Like before, Black can easily settle himself by leaning on White. To do so, he will attach her at a, b or c depending on what area he thinks is the most important around.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W High second approach $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . a O . . . . . $$ | . . . X . c . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . 1 b . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

For instance, if he really wants to, Black can keep White out of the corner.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$ Double approach 8 $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . 9 8 . . . . . . $$ | . . 7 6 1 O . . . . . $$ | . . . X 4 2 . . . , . $$ | . . . 5 3 . . . . . . $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

But if Black doesn't want to help White develop her primary side, he'll choose to lean on the high approach stone instead.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$ Double approach 9 $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . 4 6 . O . . . . . $$ | . . . X . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . 3 . . . . . . $$ | . . . O 1 . . . . . . $$ | . . . 5 2 . . . . . . $$ | . . . 7 . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Conversely, if Black's focus is more on the backside, then he should lean on the low approach stone and develop some influence facing it.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$ Double approach 10' $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . 8 . . . . . . . . $$ | . . 5 4 6 O . . . . . $$ | . a . X . 1 2 . . , . $$ | . . . 7 . 3 . . . . . $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W Double approach 10'' $$ ----------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . 3 . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . 1 O . . . . . $$ | . . . X . X O . . , . $$ | . . . 2 . X . . . . . $$ | . . a O . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . b . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

In conclusion, the Star Point corner stone can manage easily any double approach, either by settling itself or by developing some influence.
Its high position may not be the best to defend territory, but it ensures it is quite safe - even when outnumbered. That is why, theoretically, responding the opponent's approach isn't as urgent when playing at the Star Point as it is with any other corner stone.
Anyway, those who (like me) tend to always respond to an approach move should look out for a chance to ignore it. This might be the shortest way to better understand the so called Star Point's flexibility.

Dontbtme's Star Point study

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