It's been a while, but a new edition of the legendary GoGoD database has just been released on https://gogodonline.co.uk/

This edition has over 115,400 sgf games. New highlights include:

1. The complete games of Shuwa (over 600).

2. Quite a few new Segoe games (and others from the same era) in connection with working on The Life & Times of Segoe Kensaku. Segoe's own total is now approaching 500.

3. 200 games by Sumire.

4. The two Chos, Chikun and Hun-hyeon are still the leaders and the only players over 2,000 games. But both are still playing and Chikun is fast approaching 2,500.

5. A newly discovered Go Seigen game, bringing his total to 898.

The database is also available in the SmartGo app, of course, and this has been updated much more regularly. Indeed, we have decided to update that version now about monthly (Apple has made some changes which apparently make updating of apps a lot easier).

I use the GoGoD onomasticon far more than I would have expected. It's often the only place to find information in English. Like if someone wanted to look up Hayashi Genbi's rank promotion (I forget why I wanted to). I see on the website that it's still being updated ((Now includes the updated names dictionary in xml format (Windows reader included) - 4,475 entries!). So thank you.

Let me know if there's a graded onomasticon quiz that I can submit answers for in order to obtain a signed deluxe GoGoD CD certificate combo.

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Smart Go does not include the onomasticon, does it? I was considering purchasing a Smart Go subscription (though I am anti-subscription) since I have difficulty importing games (mostly from GoGoD) into the Smart Go app (it's one by one). I should probably give it a chance.

I'm not actually a SmartGo user (don't have to be, plus it's too complicated for me - too state of the art and too many bells and whistles for an old man). But I do supply the onomasticon to Anders and he does proof-read it, and he uses it to check the player names in the database games. But where it is within the app I wot not. There is more than one SmartGo product, though, so maybe it's hiding somewhere else. Mac iOS users get offered more than Windows people, I believe.

But I do know that in the app I have (on Windows), you don't have to import any GoGoD games, because they are all there already. And with the subscription you get new ones each month or so.

I think there is also some sort of tie-in with SmartGo Books now, but I'm not the one to advise on such things.

There is a “players” section in the SmartGo app that includes the biographical information for each player, a quick link to all of their games in the database, and career details such as rank progression. Presumably, all of this information is drawn from the onimasticon.

Thanks for the tip! I did not recognize this section of the app because it only included ~150 players compared to the file I'm used to reviewing. It was set up as a demo.

I activated the "Smart Go One" subscription and now there are 4,455 players and 115,316 games (instead of a few hundred or so). The GoGoD onomasticon displays nicely. You can even search with Chinese characters and click links in the bio to view other people. This feature isn't highlighted on the front page of their website (that I see) but it was mentioned in the app as being a "Pro" feature.

I had been considering Smart Go and so I'm happy for the collaboration. Thanks to everyone.

I was wondering, have you any fairly definite plans on when the next edition of GoGoD will be released? I don't mean to sound cheap (though I suppose I do), but I was thinking of buying a copy, and wondered if I should wait for a new version.

Of course, if the next version is not due until sometime next year, then I will buy the 2022 version now (perhaps before the day is over). But if a new version is coming in the next month or so, then I will wait, and just continue using my 2012 edition in the meantime

_________________
And the go-fever which is more real than many doctors’ diseases, waked and raged...
- Rudyard Kipling, "The Light That Failed" (1891)

I offer updates through SmartGo whenever Anders asks for one, which is about every three months or so. That includes both the games and the Onomasticon.

On the GoGoD website, I tend to update irrationally, for example only when there's a landmark number. The next one would probably 120,000 games, which is not far off, but I expect I'll combine that into a Christmas update. Only the website offers the GoGoD Encyclopaedia package, but that is a legacy item now - never updated.

The website https://gogodonline.co.uk/ also contains details of all available books. The Segoe biography is now ready for proof-reading but as it's very big (almost 500 pages), that will take some time. Next in line is Volume 1 in a series on the tsumego classics. This is also ready for proof-reading but it's an even bigger whopper. It includes all the problems from Carefree & Innocent Pastime (Wangyou Qingle Ji) and Gateway to All Marvels (Xuanxuan Qijing) with full explanation of all the names and collation of many pro comments on the solutions. I hope to have them both ready well before Christmas, but given their size you might want to start dropping hints to loved ones.

But that's through the app, isn't it? Unix-like users are out of luck.



That's a name that's always there, and yet... it's always _there_, if I can mess the language. He's in everything from the Atom Bomb game to Go Seigen, Cho Hun-hyeon... I'm assuming he was also somewhat tied to the Honinbo retirement... He had a quite prolific life, influenced modern Go in 1001 ways... and yet, there's very little on him, personally. There must be lots in Japanese, sure, but you "know" what I mean.



Is there going to be some sort of level indicator? Can I ask about the overall structure of the collection?

I don't think I've ever written you this, but thank you. I appreciate the effort, dedication and those difficulties I'm aware of.

Take care.

_________________
一碁一会

It is not possible to answer these questions properly, as these questions should not have been asked!

It is important to realise that the ancient problem collections were not a set of graded drills such as we are used to. Instead, each problem was an objet d'art in its own right, and was meant to be discussed by a group of friends. A name attached to the problem (before or after the discussion) could chance the debate by making allusions to ancient stories or heroes that each guest would know - rather as if we were too say "Oh, just like William Tell shooting at the apple." We would all know (I hope!) that his son was involved, the apple was on the lad's head, and it was all due to a horrible bailiff called Gessler.

Try to imagine a go problem where this name might apply. A lone black stone on a clump of white stones that resemble a boy's head? Or imagine instead a problem where the solution resembles shooting an arrow but one that has to be very precise. Both scenarios might fit. The former would be a way of helping you remember the shape of the problem, the latter would be a clue to both finding and remembering the solution.

Ancient Chinese gentlemen lived at a time when paper was very expensive and books were relatively rare. They relied on memory. Indeed, much of their general education involved memorising the classics, such as the Analects. This was called 'backing the books' (turning your back to the books as you recited them to your teacher of father). Go Seigen had to go through this process. Mistakes were punished by a cane across the calves. My own education wasn't that much different, really, so I have a good memory?

What was I saying? Oh yes, we can't be 100% that this is how things worked, but we do know for certain that memorising whole games as a way of preserving them was estemed. We have written records of this. As to the objets d'art element, we have a text from the poet Tao Yuanming 陶渊明 (c. 365 ~ 427) in which he says, "Everyone loves gathering with their neighbours over wine to appreciate newly found documents together, analysing their nuances and meanings.” The same sort of thing is recorded by other writers, with someone showing off, say, a new painting, a rare vase, or even a prized stallion.

There are other go records which strongly hint at this kind of process, for example a guest going on a visit to an exile in the countryside may take along a copy of a new book (the Xuanxuan Qijing even!)

It also follows from this kind of activity that what the group of players would be looking at is not the dross of a simple ko, but a complex line that ends in a under-the-stones. The practice of modern writers saying an old problem is a cook or is flawed because it has a ko variant or multiple solutions quite miss the point. And shame on them!

Another consequence is that guests might take a problem home (in their heads) and recreate it slightly differently. He might even try to improve it (or perhaps simplify it). And so variants arise. I called the Xuanxuan Qijing "Gateway to All Marvels" for several reasons. The most important was probably that it is the most significant go book ever written, because of what it has spawned, and so it is truly a "gateway" to modern go. But another reason was there is no one XXQJ. There are several, and each can be very different. I collected all the variants and ended up with over 460 problems. The oldest original has around 360. So GTAM was meant to refer to this omnibus edition. I also collected all the pro opinions, which quite often contradict each other. Since quite a few of the problems are rated at 7-dan plus, or the like, that's not too surprising. The ancients had their own method of grading. For example, a title along the lines of "Entering the realms of the sublime" or "refining cinnabar" or any other Daoist practice always rells us it's very hard problem (and is also a clue in itself).

What I hoped to recreate for the modern reader was a book that would him to bask in the same joyful sort of environment as the wrinklies of old (but bring your own wine!). To do that, I needed to add a lot of text. So, where the ancient book presents the problem below (White to play) with the simple title "Hooked dagger is released" (鉤戈解) that is probably going to make the modern western reader feel as if he had guzzled the wine before looking at the problem! What I have done therefore, is to add an explanation of what was probably going through the minds of these players of old, and so I am obvioulsy also proving a memory aid and clues.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

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$$ | . . X O . O X . . . . .
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$$ | . . . X O . O O X . . .
$$ | . . . X O . . O X . . .
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The following is what I added to this problem (in the presentation part - there is often more to say in the solution part - omitted here).

I can't judge about "properly", but you did answer. And if I hadn't asked, you wouldn't have.



I think I've only browsed two "old" collections. Kita Fumiko's and Huang Lonsghi's (the easy volume). The later, with Roman numerals. Both are more... "tsumego"-like.



See? You just got me a level for those problems, or a rating.

I'm not asking for anything definite or too specific. I'm asking at what level it makes sense to try solving them. Because, right now, for a 7th dan level, I might as well roll dice. And, well, the structure of the book, you did answer. The one for the collection, not yet. I'm not sure if you want to do one book per collection, or group them by theme, or... I think I understand you want to do a modern edition of the classics, one per original book.

Thanks; take care.

_________________
一碁一会

Hello,
Is a kind of "Christmas version" still in plans?
As Tundra was, I am thinking of buying a copy of the database, but willing to wait a bit if a new update is on the pipe.

I'd recommend waiting as the current version is much larger - about 122,000 games. I give priority to other projects because I know the latest version will always be available in SmartGo. I know it's a trivial task to make it available online at the same time, but there's an element of wanting to support Anders by giving him an "exclusive", and also a psychological aspect (i.e. laziness). Once I'm in the zone with a book, I like to focus on that obsessively. I got the huge Segoe book out at last, and at the moment I am doing the indexing for Vol. 1 of the Encyclopaedia of Classical Go Problems. It's about 560 pages long, so you can see why it takes a while. Probably I'll do the update once I get that out of my hair.

Thank you for your answer.

I will take patience then, and meanwhile keep on going through pro games the old way -- I've just finished to replay Shuei's games, from your book, by writing them first on a game record, and only then replaying them on a board. Guess I have to do the same with the next player in my list, Go Seigen.

(I have to say I actually enjoy the whole process, though, so maybe I will stick with it even when I have the database.)

Hello again,

I am just wondering if we can hope for a summer 2024 edition ?...

I feel a bit guilty. On the other hand, I do issue the latest version via SmartGo every few weeks (currently knocking on the door of 125,000 games). In addition, I am working hard on two books close to publication or proofreading: Volume 2 of the classical problems encyclopaedia and a new twice-as-big edition of Go Consultants.

Despite that it is on my to-do list. Honestly.



I'm very curious why you do it this way. I can sense some value in it, but I've never come across it before, so my opinions are still unformed. Care to elaborate? (I have recently found a new game by Shuei, incidentally.)

Second this!

_________________
Dave Sigaty
"Short-lived are both the praiser and the praised, and rememberer and the remembered..."
- Marcus Aurelius; Meditations, VIII 21

That's really good news ! I was looking for this book without success.


That is good to know. Thanks for your answer. I hope I'll be able to buy it soon.


My answer won't be that interesting, I am afraid.
After the reading of Meijin of Meijins, I was genuinely willing to discover Shuei's games and to feel, at my level at least, how beautiful they can be. So I bought Games of Shuei, and really enjoyed it ; just by reading it I had something like an aperçu of the games. However, that is obviously not enough. I also wanted to follow your own advice, that I red somwhere in this forum, to go through many games, in order to develop some kind of intuition. I remember you told about an exercise in Japanese magazines, with a single game diagram to replay as fast as possible. That way you have to build some intuition to look for the next move. I wanted to do so with Shuei's games, so I needed full-game diagrams.

My first idea was to buy the database and print the game files, but story began around January 2023, so I was thinking "the latest edition was summer 2022, let's wait for the next one, it should be there soon!...". Meanwhile I decided to write down the games first, in order to have full diagrams to play through in front on my board.

I don't know if it is good practice or not, but I actually enjoy it. It makes me fore familiar with the games. In total I went through many Shuei games four times (not at once, obviously!):
1 - A first time by just reading the book and looking at the diagrams. Enjoyable, but I can hardly say I remembered any move nor understood the games by just doing so. This is probably not good practice, but I did it anyway, before I decided to replay the games.
2 - A second time writing down the game on a game record. Sometimes I really pay attention to what is happening, sometimes I just write the numbers mindlessly.
3 - A third time, ideally the next day after step 2, playing the game on a board, with the game record under my eyes. Some parts of the games I discovered there, some others I remembered from the previous step- maybe this way, it helps building some intuition, making me more familiar with it?
4 - Sometimes, just after replaying the game, I have some questions about one move or another, so I re-read your commentaries with fresh eyes, knowing a little better what is at stake in the game.

Obviously, it makes me really slow. I took me the whole year 2023 to go through 90 games of Shuei that way (my game record has 90 sheets).

One good point of this method, however, is that of the two important steps (2 and 3) ony one really need me to focus (effortful study!). Some days (generally, it's at night, after work...) when I am too tired to replay a game (because I have to actively look for the moves, sometimes over a long endgame or a complicated ko battle with ko threats all over the board), I am somewhat relieved that I did it the day before, and so this time I "just" have to take my pens and write the next one. I think it helped me to somehow keep the rhythm.

In the process I could observe some changes in my own games, some moves, extensions or shapes that I was not using before appearing instantly in my mind...


I am doing the same thing with a "Go Seigen" theme now, still with a 90 games objective : I have gone through Archers of Yue, Old Fuseki vs New Fuseki, Kamakura, and I just began to write the first 10-games match with Fujisawa Kuranosuke in 9 Dan Showdown. I am really willing to find some other games not in the books I own, though, like the ones against Karigane Junichi.



And now you make me curious about this new game of Shuei...

Hi Songe

Your answer IS interesting. Thank you for sharing. As it happens, I think it will be especially useful for you when reading the new Go Consultants. I say that because, as part of my own proofreading, I had to go through the entire game in a way that has some important overlap with the way you work. The point is that it is a single book on one game and so there is a lot of commentary (6 humans and one AI). To give diagrams for all of the variations talked about would just result in a blizzard of diagrams and resulting go blindness. Instead, I have mixed diagrams with use of coordinates in text. I found that this did indeed result in effortful practice. It makes you concentrate, make you focus, makes you think about the moves, and is rather easy to do. At least as far as I was concerned.

The other change in the new version of the book is restoration of all the historical anecdotes. They are not obviously related to the game, but there can be fascinating insights. For example, comparing Honinbo Doetsu precepts with the way the more modern players talk about the game shows some remarkable pro-level parallels, but also significant differences (e.g. time management). But at the purely pedagogical level, the change of pace from the relentless commentary provides a sense of rest and then revitalisation in the reader.

Go Consultants will be sent off to the external proofreader in a coupe of days. I can't be sure how long he will take, but on past performance I think you can expect the book to appear in a few weeks.

The new Shuei game was a rengo, so not so interesting. But there were also new individual games by the the likes of Shuwa and so on. I found it interesting (that word again!) that I could easily tell it was a game by Shuwa when I was transcribing it. Shuei is famously esteemed for his style, but I think of all the players I've looked at, Shuwa is possibly the easiest one to spot. I think this is because he is so different from the players around him (a characteristic he shares with Go Seigen and Huang Longshi). I think your method of study will be giving you the same sort of feeling for individual styles.