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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #121 Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 8:07 pm 
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AKaios wrote:
I just reread it. For some reason it sounded different the first time, sorry for the confusion!

Try rereading go books as well. Good ones seem different upon rereading as you gain strength.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #122 Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 1:01 pm 
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AKaios wrote:
oren wrote:
AKaios wrote:
Why am I sensing condescension...? I'm asking for help, not any sort of criticism.


It's not criticism. He's trying to help.


I just reread it. For some reason it sounded different the first time, sorry for the confusion!

when I was your level, I bought lots of books that were really aimed at stronger players. I ending up not really reading them. They didn't help me.

Would I recommend other beginners buying those books? Probably not.
Would I buy them again if I were still at that beginner level? Probably :)

I like books :)

The best way to get stronger is to play games, not reading books (with some exceptions).


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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #123 Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 9:52 pm 
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xed_over wrote:
when I was your level, I bought lots of books that were really aimed at stronger players. I ending up not really reading them. They didn't help me.

Would I recommend other beginners buying those books? Probably not.
Would I buy them again if I were still at that beginner level? Probably :)

I like books :)

The best way to get stronger is to play games, not reading books (with some exceptions).


This. A thousand times, this.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #124 Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:20 am 
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Boidhre wrote:
xed_over wrote:
when I was your level, I bought lots of books that were really aimed at stronger players. I ending up not really reading them. They didn't help me.

Would I recommend other beginners buying those books? Probably not.
Would I buy them again if I were still at that beginner level? Probably :)

I like books :)

The best way to get stronger is to play games, not reading books (with some exceptions).


This. A thousand times, this.


I dont't agree, when i was 20kyu kgs I got tesuji by james davies and read it through in like 2 weeks.
I tried to read all sequences even if I really could not.

After I did this I was 16 kyu kgs.

So it does not really matter if you get experience in books or on a board. But you are going to need reading experience. And some experience of the "flow" of the game.

Enjoy ;-)
Otenki

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #125 Posted: Sat May 24, 2014 8:55 pm 
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Books I own:

Korean Style of Baduk I
Opening Theory made easy
The second book of go
Endgame
Attack and Defence
The Direction of play
Get Strong at Tesuji (Shipping)
Get Strong at invading (Shipping)

I've read all of these books at least once through (Except for Korean Style of Baduk), and reread them equally as much. Of course, I'm going to continue to do that, but does anyone have suggestions for what an 8-9k could buy in addition to these? I'd like to start a book collection.

Also, would anyone suggest Yilun Yang's fundamentals of go?

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #126 Posted: Sun May 25, 2014 6:55 am 
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Abyssinica wrote:
Also, would anyone suggest Yilun Yang's fundamentals of go?


Yes, it's a very good book.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #127 Posted: Sun May 25, 2014 12:07 pm 
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Abyssinica wrote:
Of course, I'm going to continue to do that, but does anyone have suggestions for what an 8-9k could buy in addition to these? I'd like to start a book collection.

I must recommend Kageyama Toshiro's Lessons in the Fundamentals of Go - I love that book and I truly believe it has made me a stronger player. I don't think any SDK collection would be complete without it.

Our university club is buying two books with school funds to begin building a club collection. The two books we are getting are: The Second Book of Go and Lessons in the Fundamentals of Go. We wanted to start with these because they are widely recommended and both cover the entire game of go. You already have the former, so I recommend the latter.

Abyssinica wrote:
Also, would anyone suggest Yilun Yang's fundamentals of go?

A 2k member of the West Michigan Go Club has been going through that book for a second time recently. He says it is very good, and he must believe that if he is taking the time to read it again.

Those two books have some commonalities. I haven't personally read Yilun Yang's book - although I've looked at the section on joseki. It has some similarities to Kageyama's book, but emphasizes the whole board thinking aspect of joseki to a greater degree, while Kageyama emphasizes the importance of not memorizing joseki. Both discussed both, of course. It is just a matter of how many pages they devoted to each idea.

Perhaps you should read both? The fundamentals of go are truly important. I don't see how it could hurt to have it hammered home by both of these books.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #128 Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 3:15 am 
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I have two books from the heart of Go Discovery series and I'm wondering what you guys would rate them on Content + skill level. I'm thinking I should get the rest of them eventually.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #129 Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 7:55 am 
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Abyssinica wrote:
I have two books from the heart of Go Discovery series and I'm wondering what you guys would rate them on Content + skill level. I'm thinking I should get the rest of them eventually.


My impression was that they tend towards strong SDK to maybe mid-dan level. Which ones are they?

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #130 Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 5:23 pm 
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skydyr wrote:
Abyssinica wrote:
I have two books from the heart of Go Discovery series and I'm wondering what you guys would rate them on Content + skill level. I'm thinking I should get the rest of them eventually.


My impression was that they tend towards strong SDK to maybe mid-dan level. Which ones are they?


The art of creating a thick and strong game + Vital points and skillfull finesse for sabaki.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #131 Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:12 pm 
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Abyssinica wrote:
Go Discovery series and I'm wondering what you guys would rate them on Content + skill level.


Little theory contents; it is mainly showing games. Therefore, I have not been motivated to buy one of the books and have not looked closely enough to suggest a skill level more precise than "probably for SDK". If you want to learn go theory, read other books.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #132 Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 12:30 pm 
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Hi.

One friend borught me two books of tsumego of "Step by Step Weiqi Classroom" from China.
I am checking the first that it is "From Beginner to Amateur Shodan", it can be good for 5ºkyu until 1ºdan. It is a pite that I don't know more chinese than "play black/white, tesuji, miai... words to know only what to do :cry:

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #133 Posted: Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:32 pm 
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The three books that I feel have helped me the most in progressing from 15k to 7k are:

Tesuji by James Davies
Attack and Defense by Ishida Akira
Opening Theory Made Easy by Otake Hideo

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #134 Posted: Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:30 pm 
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These can help anyone get stronger. viewtopic.php?f=17&t=10643

Now, if someone would just put out a collection of Dosaku's games in PDF format, I would smile from ear to ear. I like Doteki's games, but I have only 12 games in my possession.

Theory books are beneficial for getting stronger after a few lost games and replaying of game records of historical and, to a greater extent, modern pros (since a good number of diagrams in Go theory books are taken from pro games). Otherwise, the contents will not be easy to assimilate.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #135 Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2019 2:05 am 
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Gresil wrote:
... but Lessons in the Fundamentals has turned out to be the textbook that's given me the least new insight on re-reads.


It's not always about quantity but quality. That book did help me to get in crisis with myself and that was so valuable. A book which can point you how badly you play, especially when you get stuck at some level (for me at 10k) is a precious tool. With it you don't learn that much more things, instead you go to think on what you learned and check it.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #136 Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2019 2:48 am 
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otenki wrote:
Boidhre wrote:
xed_over wrote:
when I was your level, I bought lots of books that were really aimed at stronger players. I ending up not really reading them. They didn't help me.

Would I recommend other beginners buying those books? Probably not.
Would I buy them again if I were still at that beginner level? Probably :)

I like books :)

The best way to get stronger is to play games, not reading books (with some exceptions).


This. A thousand times, this.


I dont't agree, when i was 20kyu kgs I got tesuji by james davies and read it through in like 2 weeks.
I tried to read all sequences even if I really could not.

After I did this I was 16 kyu kgs.

So it does not really matter if you get experience in books or on a board. But you are going to need reading experience. And some experience of the "flow" of the game.

Enjoy ;-)
Otenki


Tesuji (the book) did help me a lot to go from like 8k to 5k.

Reading books won't harm your go strength really, it's a matter of efficiency and it's usually more effective to play as to read.

Efficiency is not all, the fun has a place too so if you have fun reading, do it!

Reading power in go is often acquired by doing go problems, which are coming from books.
So reading books can even be very effective later, with some discipline.

Today's concern is the new theory covered by irruption of the AI which could make a lot of books a bit obsolete but which still remains to be written.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #137 Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2019 11:10 am 
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Tryphon wrote:
BUT WHERE IS KAGEYAMA ???????


This was my first and only thought, and it bears repeating until everyone reads him. I'm especially finding him helpful because a lot of his examples of bad play look like my games :-? I have to do better!

The way he doesn't just go "this move is best" but also explains WHY in a way that's actually comprehensible is amazing. Plus he actually understands what it's like to play against people stronger than you, he knows how to make you see what you're doing wrong in a way that isn't just "this is wrong" for impenetrable reasons.

Go people love to speak in code to seem smart, but not him. I finally understand what thickness actually is, for instance, and why you don't use it to make territory. All sorts of things like this are becoming clear, more and more with each page.

The yellow book? More like the golden book.

I don't know if I would have gotten the same benefit if I'd read it as a 30k just starting out. I probably would have just thought it was great, not outright amazing. It's very very VERY good for mid-teens DDK though. And strong fundamentals can benefit anyone imo. :tmbup:

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #138 Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2020 3:05 pm 
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This is my first post, so if this the wrong place to ask, then let me know.

I am just getting back into Go after a long hiatus. The highest I've gotten on any server was 2k on OGS. I almost never counted or cared about endgame, and I think that lead to a large gap in my play, since I would either win by a large margin or overplay and lose by a large margin. I would love to read an effective book on counting, endgame calculations, and how to go from a late middle game position to the end. Basically, anything on winning relatively close games.

As a side note, I have an account on IGS that is pretty low ranked, and the ranking system makes it difficult to rank up quickly. So I am going to try to win games against much weaker opponents by a specific number of points (5.5 or 10.5). This will hopefully provide a lot of practice, but it will also make me feel like less of a sandbagger.

Any advice or recommendations welcome.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #139 Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2021 5:29 am 
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SoDesuNe wrote:
Also, I like to add that it can be interesting to replay (and memorize, if you like) professional games in the intermediate range. If you like to do so, I'd strongly recommend commented games, so that you know which moves are good or bad and why. My choices would be games by Shusaku (Book: Invincible), Go Seigen, Cho Chikun or by the early Lee Chang'ho. In my experience these games are pretty straight forward and 'easy to follow' at some level.


For studying professional games, are there games of any players in the past 20 years and in the past 5 years that are also easy to follow? Where I came from is the significant changes over these years, and especially during the post-AI era, and I am wondering if most recent games are also if not more helpful.

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 Post subject: Re: Useful books to become stronger
Post #140 Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2021 7:18 am 
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FinrodFelagund wrote:
This is my first post, so if this the wrong place to ask, then let me know.

I am just getting back into Go after a long hiatus. The highest I've gotten on any server was 2k on OGS. I almost never counted or cared about endgame, and I think that lead to a large gap in my play, since I would either win by a large margin or overplay and lose by a large margin. I would love to read an effective book on counting, endgame calculations, and how to go from a late middle game position to the end. Basically, anything on winning relatively close games.

As a side note, I have an account on IGS that is pretty low ranked, and the ranking system makes it difficult to rank up quickly. So I am going to try to win games against much weaker opponents by a specific number of points (5.5 or 10.5). This will hopefully provide a lot of practice, but it will also make me feel like less of a sandbagger.

Any advice or recommendations welcome.


Another idea: avoid big fights, even if you go into the endgame being behind. Then play your best endgame. Reserve all your overtime time periods for the endgame (but use your main time not to run into disaster)

Caveat: I've tried this idea myself and it didn't do a lot for me. Analyzing my games with KataGo, they are still very much decided in the middle game, where swings of 10+ points frequently happen. But, like Bill says: above all study what you like.

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