RobertJasiek wrote:
Liisa wrote:
Here I would like to outline the championship tournament where I would like to participate as a player and a spectator.
Which is your rank? Can you prove what your rank is by stating your real name? Is your rank relevant for the EC or are you a kyu player, who just benefits from the marketing gag that the EC would be a tournament for players of all strengths?
(...)
2) That kyu players and low dans play in what is called the EGC is a marketing gag rather than evidence of quality.
Firstly Robert, your tone is really unpleasant in this reply and completely uncalled for.
Liisas analysis this time is perfectly reasonable and also contains some interesting observations.
Secondly, your quoted statements probably explain why your views on the EGC are so odd.
Clearly anyone is free to have whatever preferences and priorities regarding the EGC, but yours are
very odd (as far as I can see, of course) and consequently not very relevant for the decisions to
be made.
You call the EGC a "marketing gag".
But the EGC is in fact a great success story, understandably copied by the americans.
The EGC has large and growing numbers of participants, from Europe and from outside.
The EGC, for the same reason presumably, also attracts sponsors. The EGC is a great opportunity
to enjoy go and to improve at go, at every level. I also believe that he EGC is good marketing
of go, mainly due to its size. The EGC is the biggest go event in the western world and the only
go event that is big enough to be comparable to other sports events, generally speaking. The EGC
is also a great opportunity for contacts between European players and strong players from the
more developed go countries in asia, professionals as well as amateurs. As far as I know it is thanks
to the EGC that Catalin and probably a number of other top European players got in contact with the
far east pro world.
People come to the EGC to play serious games with players at their own level, whatever that may be, to have an opportunity to get feedback on their games from stronger players, to enjoy summer vacation doing something they like (play go), perhaps bringing their families too, to meet go friends from all over Europe and from elsewhere, to visit every year a new place in Europe and for the numerous splendid side activities that are organizad at the EGC.
Only to very few EGC participants it is a major attraction to watch the games at the top boards or to see who is going to become European Champion. Even fewer aspire at the title themselves. The majority of EGC participants probably don't know who is at present European Champion and don't care very much. I strongly doubt that any single player has ever participated in the EGC mainly to "brag" about having taken part in a European Championship, as you suggest, Robert.
Of course the title is important too, the Championship, and generally the elite competition, bringing the strongest European players together. But the matter of the title is clearly of secondary importance besides the bulk activities of the go congress, by any measure. For example economically: it is the large crowd of kyu and lower dan players who provide the financial resources in terms of registration fees, it is the large number of participants that attracts local sponsors, reduced accomodation charges and likely international sponsors as well. The title at stake and the Championship of course does its part too to attract sponsors, but less so than the numerous participation is what I think. If anything it is the title and Chamionship that might be termed a "marketing gag".
At the third level of general interest is precisely how the European Champion is appointed, matters of tiebreakers and what not. Yes, of course those matters ave their interest and importance too, but they are by no means comparable to the main activities at the EGC.
Now, it is true that some top players have been complaining about the sloppy way the Championship is determined, and that criticism is perfecly understandable and justified, as far as it goes. The number of ways to mend those problems that have been proposed is becoming innumerable, one more complicated than the other, but it has not been possible to agree on anything so far. We'll se how it goes this year. But the difficulties to agree may be a sign that most people like the congress as it is and that it is not so easy to fix the problem without creating new ones.
So how about returning to the idea of separating the EGC and the open European Championship from a closed European Championship to be held independently on some other occasion? For example there is some discussion now on a European Champions League, where all national champions would meet. Why not develop this into the new, closed European Championship? It could be a knock out tournament. Optionally one could include a few places for the best placed europeans in the Open European Championship (EGC). This has the advantage that it lends some more prestige to the national championships, which might be good particularly in the smaller countries. Or else the elite closed tournament could be set up with some other selection scheme, e.g. like the Ing memorial. Personally I would say that selection in qualification tournaments is better than just selecting the highest rated players, since it stimulates tournament play further down the line. What are the drawbacks with a separate closed elite tournament? Firstly the marketing value of the EGC might drop a bit (not very much is my expectation). Secondly, on the other hand, maybe the top players feel that they need the money from the EGC (the registration fees from the many kyu players and the sponsorship that the EGC can attract due to its large numbers) towards price money. In a sense, these drawbacks can not both be important - if the marketing value of the title tournament is great, it can find its own sponsors. If it is not it doesnt mean so much to lose it from the EGC. Anyway, it may be a price worth paying for not messing around too much with the EGC. Are there any other drawbacks with separating the elite championship from the summer vacation EGC family event?
best regards,
Henric