Attack from your weakness towards your strenght?
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lightvector
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Re: Attack from your weakness towards your strenght?
Do you know where one can obtain the game record? With some searching online I found some videos of earlier matches at https://www.youtube.com/@nakaneigo-doujyo/videos but seemingly not of the match you presented the opening of here.
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Knotwilg
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Re: Attack from your weakness towards your strenght?
A KataGo review of my latest game reminded me of this thread. First position:
Although KataGo's focus is on the cut at A in the upper right, my focus - and I assume many of yours - was on the upper left. The thread is a giveaway but where would you play as White? And even with the hint KataGo's preference may still surprise you.
Position 2:
A few moves later, another example fitting this thread.
Although KataGo's focus is on the cut at A in the upper right, my focus - and I assume many of yours - was on the upper left. The thread is a giveaway but where would you play as White? And even with the hint KataGo's preference may still surprise you.
A few moves later, another example fitting this thread.
is on the fourth line too and getting sufficiently close to the wall to start forming a moyo of proper dimensions. B is wider, perhaps too wide.-
dust
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Re: Attack from your weakness towards your strenght?
Knotwilg wrote:A KataGo review of my latest game reminded me of this thread. First position:
Although KataGo's focus is on the cut at A in the upper right, my focus - and I assume many of yours - was on the upper left. The thread is a giveaway but where would you play as White? And even with the hint KataGo's preference may still surprise you.
Position 2:
A few moves later, another example fitting this thread.
It is an interesting example. Looking at the second diagram, I didn't like the cramped ugly shape Black has ended up with.
If I were playing Black, I'd like to challenge W's use of the new AI orthodoxy of leaving the wall undefended - by playing 49 at D9.
Playing your 48 at C12 is ambitious AI style to gain maximum points, but I'd personally worry I'd have to be KataGo strength to manage the complex fighting in any counter-attack.
[Edited: to remove my confusion over move numbers and my first unsuccessful attempt at using a diagram]
Last edited by dust on Sun Feb 25, 2024 3:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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jlt
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Re: Attack from your weakness towards your strenght?
Probably the reasons of Katago's suggestions are:Knotwilg wrote:First position:
- it's the common base of two weak groups;
- the move is reverse sente.
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John Fairbairn
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Re: Attack from your weakness towards your strenght?
lightvector:
PW[Katago]
PB[Nakane Naoyuki]
HA[2]
RE[W+R]
US[GoGoD95]
AB[dp][pd]
;W[pp];B[cd];W[cn];B[fq];W[ed];B[ec];W[fc];B[dc];W[fd];B[cf];W[nc];B[jd]
;W[lc];B[oc];W[nd];B[pf];W[jf];B[kc];W[le];B[hd];W[hf];B[ge];W[dd];B[cc]
;W[df];B[gf];W[cg];B[bf];W[dg];B[hg];W[dj];B[if];W[ig];B[he];W[qh];B[re]
;W[je];B[ld];W[ih];B[lb];W[ob];B[pb];W[mb];B[gi];W[md];B[mc];W[og];B[qn]
;W[qo];B[pn];W[np];B[pk];W[gp];B[gq];W[ip];B[of];W[ng];B[ke];W[kf];B[dk]
;W[ej];B[kd];W[mf];B[lg];W[lf];B[dm];W[eo];B[cp];W[dn];B[em];W[hi];B[gj]
;W[gh];B[hb];W[gb];B[jb];W[ck];B[cl];W[bk];B[hj];W[hh];B[ek];W[bl];B[gn]
;W[hl];B[gl];W[hm];B[hk];W[jl];B[jj];W[gm];B[fm];W[hq];B[fp];W[fo];B
(;SZ[19]FF[3]Do you know where one can obtain the game record?
PW[Katago]
PB[Nakane Naoyuki]
HA[2]
RE[W+R]
US[GoGoD95]
AB[dp][pd]
;W[pp];B[cd];W[cn];B[fq];W[ed];B[ec];W[fc];B[dc];W[fd];B[cf];W[nc];B[jd]
;W[lc];B[oc];W[nd];B[pf];W[jf];B[kc];W[le];B[hd];W[hf];B[ge];W[dd];B[cc]
;W[df];B[gf];W[cg];B[bf];W[dg];B[hg];W[dj];B[if];W[ig];B[he];W[qh];B[re]
;W[je];B[ld];W[ih];B[lb];W[ob];B[pb];W[mb];B[gi];W[md];B[mc];W[og];B[qn]
;W[qo];B[pn];W[np];B[pk];W[gp];B[gq];W[ip];B[of];W[ng];B[ke];W[kf];B[dk]
;W[ej];B[kd];W[mf];B[lg];W[lf];B[dm];W[eo];B[cp];W[dn];B[em];W[hi];B[gj]
;W[gh];B[hb];W[gb];B[jb];W[ck];B[cl];W[bk];B[hj];W[hh];B[ek];W[bl];B[gn]
;W[hl];B[gl];W[hm];B[hk];W[jl];B[jj];W[gm];B[fm];W[hq];B[fp];W[fo];B
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lightvector
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dust
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Re: Attack from your weakness towards your strenght?
Off-topic: but are there any views on Nakane Naoyuki's 12-game uchikomi match with katago?
It will be interesting to see how it turns out of course. But as a thought experiment, I wonder if a strong amateur who specialises for a while in 2 and 3 stone games with Katago, and explores thoroughly what it recommends for Black, may end up a stronger niche specialist in low handicap go with katago than a 9dan pro coming to it afresh?
It will be interesting to see how it turns out of course. But as a thought experiment, I wonder if a strong amateur who specialises for a while in 2 and 3 stone games with Katago, and explores thoroughly what it recommends for Black, may end up a stronger niche specialist in low handicap go with katago than a 9dan pro coming to it afresh?