Peep and extend question

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Dusk Eagle
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Peep and extend question

Post by Dusk Eagle »

I was facing a friend yesterday and he played a shape twice which I'm not sure I responded optimally to either time. I ended up winning both games presented here, but I'd like some answers on how I could have handled those situations better. The outside shapes are quite different, so I'll present both games separately.

Both games are two-stone handicap games and I played white.

Game 1

This was the situation when he peeped.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . 1 . . . O . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X O . X . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . X O O , X O O O O , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . X . X O O O . O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X X O X O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X X . O . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

The game continued like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . 2 . . . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . X 1 . . O . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 5 . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . 3 . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X O . X . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . X O O , X O O O O , X . . |
$$ | . . O 4 . X . X O O O . O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X X O X O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X X . O . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm6 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . 7 . . . X . X . . . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . O . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . 3 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 5 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X O . X . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . X O O , X O O O O , X . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . X O O O . O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X X O X O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X X . O . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Was :w1: correct? How could I have handled his :b6: better? Or is the way I played good enough?

Game 2

This is where we were when he peeped. Once again, I connected solidly, and one again, he tried to pull out into the side.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , O X . O . , . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . O 3 . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . 2 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Because this variation is a lot longer, I've included an sgf of how the game went from here. I think :w49: was too early and :w51: should have been at R3, but I'm also curious how you would play in this situation, and if my move at :w71: was effective enough.

[sgf-full]http://lifein19x19.com/forum/download/file.php?id=900[/sgf-full]

Thanks for any help you can give me with these situations!
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: Peep and extend question

Post by Joaz Banbeck »

In the first game, 1 seems best as you played it. I would have played 3 at 6 ( or maybe 010 )

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . 2 . . . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . X 1 . . O . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . 3 O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]



In game 2, again your reply to the peep seems best. I would have played 4 thus:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ | . . . . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . O 3 . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . 2 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . X . . . X . O 4 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Magicwand
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Re: Peep and extend question

Post by Magicwand »

answering the peep is the best move for both.
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The greater the unknown"
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gaius
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Re: Peep and extend question

Post by gaius »

I would also connect like that. But the game result somehow feels a little unfortunate for white, I think. How about this (just an idea):
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . X . . . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . O . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . 4 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . 3 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X O . X . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . X O O , X O O O O , X . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . X O O O . O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X X O X O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X X . O . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


... with possible continuations like:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 looks good for white, I would say
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . X . . . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . 1 X O . . O . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | 3 O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X O . X . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . X O O , X O O O O , X . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . X O O O . O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X X O X O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X X . O . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

or perhaps:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Equal fight?
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . X . . . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . 4 X O . . O . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . X O 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 3 2 6 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 7 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 0 . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X O . X . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . X O O , X O O O O , X . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . X O O O . O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X X O X O . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X X . O . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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daniel_the_smith
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Re: Peep and extend question

Post by daniel_the_smith »

Almost every time I play something other than the solid connection in that position vs. a stronger player it turns out very badly for me. Also I've noticed that if I'm the one playing the peep against a weaker player, they get into a lot of trouble if they don't connect. I think you did fine, although I'm not sure how you won the first one... :)
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