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Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

https://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?t=1530

Page 8 of 16

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 9:22 am
by Joaz Banbeck
Kirby wrote:...I'm a little embarrassed, but I guess there's nothing I can do about it now.


Yes there is. You can resolve to let it never happen again. Repeat after me: "I will never let my cutting stones be captured. I will never let my cutting stones be captured..."

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 9:23 am
by Dusk Eagle
Why is either side fighting over these white stones? They were only six points before the last move by white, and they still seem small and unvaluable to me.

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:39 am
by nagano
Dusk Eagle wrote:Why is either side fighting over these white stones? They were only six points before the last move by white, and they still seem small and unvaluable to me.
Magicwand hopes he can cut at k8 later.

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:44 am
by Kirby
Joaz Banbeck wrote:
Kirby wrote:...I'm a little embarrassed, but I guess there's nothing I can do about it now.


Yes there is. You can resolve to let it never happen again. Repeat after me: "I will never let my cutting stones be captured. I will never let my cutting stones be captured..."


I figured they already served the purpose of preventing the cut, and that it would be hard to save the stones. I could be wrong, though.

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 11:23 am
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O . X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O . O . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 12:29 pm
by Kirby
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . 8 X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O . X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O . O . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I guess this is consistent with my last move, at least.

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 1:32 pm
by hyperpape
White has to cut now, right? Letting B connect is really bad, and I don't think B has any terrible move to use against the floating white stones. B will get the turn and not suffer terribly, but I don't think he's benefitted from the recent moves.

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 3:14 pm
by Joaz Banbeck
Cutting is not completely without risk. There is a bit of bad aji that black may be able to exploit:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O 1 X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O 4 O 2 . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O 3 . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 3:23 pm
by hyperpape
@Joaz
Joaz Banbeck wrote:Cutting is not completely without risk. There is a bit of bad aji that black may be able to exploit:


Duly noted, but after :w5: I don't see anything. In particular it seems that, a and b lead nowhere.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O 1 X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . 5 . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O 4 O 2 a . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O 3 b O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 6:18 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . 9 . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O . X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O . O . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
only choice i have

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 7:10 pm
by Kirby
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 0 O . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O . X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O . O . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This just feels right.

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:40 pm
by ketchup
For kibitz only:
A few moves later on, isn't this point at A very interesting? I believe the aji here is great for black. Anyone read more into it or does anyone think we will see this move anytime soon? I "skimmed" through the reading, and I feel like white has to give up something here for him to come out "even". Even if you don't follow up right away, the aji is nice.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 0 O . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O a . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O . X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O . O . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:43 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm61
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O . X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O . O . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
moves he played seems wrong. it only make my group more stable and strong. now i can invade without worrying about my weak group.

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:48 pm
by Kirby
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm61
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O . X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O . O . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I feel OK with a tenuki. I think that this move is pretty big.

Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!

Posted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 4:01 am
by Numsgil
Kirby wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm61
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O . X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O . O . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I feel OK with a tenuki. I think that this move is pretty big.


Hmm, I'd be worried about the cut. Now suddenly the stones in the center are floating, eyeless, and well within white's sector line. Which means white gets to cut in sente, and probably chase black around some more in sente while he breaks up black potential. There's also the very real possibility of those center black stones just outright dying. I think that would null out most of black's handicap stone advantage.

We'll see if MW agrees with me based on how he responds. :)

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ {LN E14 K14}
$$ {LN E14 D10}
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . X X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X O 1 X X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O X O . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . X O O . O . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O O X X X . O . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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