Life In 19x19

And last post for today, but not least - a game i played against an 8kyu (my 2nd game as an 8kyu) and quite possibly the worst defeat ive ever received on kgs. i got destroyed left to right.. and read like crap throughout the entire game. this is why i should never play anymore than 3 games a night and i hope i don't get demoted back to 9k

Charles Matthews wrote:

$$W Further reading problem
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . O X O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . O X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X W . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$W Further reading problem
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . O X O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . O X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X W . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

So what happens if White blocks on the other side?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$W Variation 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 X X X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . 6 4 O X O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . 3 O X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . 7 2 X 1 . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

So this can happen, much as before. But Black is less satisfied, given that White at ''a'' saves the corner. What else?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$B Variation 2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 0 8 X X X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . 6 . . 7 O X O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . 5 2 O O X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 4 3 1 X X O . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

What really interested me here was Black's attempt to crawl and swallow up the corner. makes it all very tight (the corner has around five liberties).

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$B Variation 2, continuation
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . B . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . b . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 0 9 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 8 5 3 7 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 6 4 2 X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . 1 O O X X X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O . . X O X O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . X O O O X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X X X X O . O c . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I think this is what should happen next, with at b giving White some bad shape.

With the marked star points in place, it seems fine for Black. After Black c White's capture on the lower side is not so big.

Comment: Books mostly shy away from crawling battles (as on the lower edge here), and pushing battles as in the centre. I think the reasons are "paternalistic": it doesn't help so much to get involved with this kind of reading, for kyu players. But this kind of study material should be collated, in some way.

hl782 wrote:And last post for today, but not least - a game i played against an 8kyu (my 2nd game as an 8kyu) and quite possibly the worst defeat ive ever received on kgs. i got destroyed left to right.. and read like crap throughout the entire game. this is why i should never play anymore than 3 games a night and i hope i don't get demoted back to 9k

is scary: I think Q9 is normal. Then your timing is off. Try at P4 before anything else. Black O7 is the answer, I guess, but then you have a push through and cut at O2.

needs to cut at R3 for some leverage. Playing at N3 may be better than M4.

Anyway, one sharp fight that went wrong isn't a reason to beat yourself up.

It's also worth considering playing R10 instead of Q10 to finish the joseki, as it creates a good base for the group and doesn't allow black to play to undercut you later. If black approaches as closely as in the game, a counterinvasion at R14 becomes a distinct possibility that black needs to take into account.

I won a couple more games as an 8kyu today - so hopefully it will stabilize my rank away from demotion. Attached are the games below.





In addition, i am now going through Lee Chang Ho Tesuji Vol. 3 - This volume seriously cranked up the difficulty compared to 1, 2 and 4. I didn't plan on touching volumes 3, 5, and 6 until I had reached higher rating but I like this series too much to not attempt them. I need to start working on the L&D series as well

I plan on recycling 1001 L&D, Get Strong at Tesuji (again), GGPB Vol. 4, and Making Good Shape when i have the time.

Last but not least - I started to watch a couple lecture series on BadukTV which in my opinion are the best i've seen so far. They are Attacking Vitamins and Invasion Vitamins - if anyone understands korean, or can find subtitled versions of them i highly recommend them.

Some comments on the second game:

Two more ranked games today - 1 win 1 loss - 1 win vs a 8 kyu, and another loss vs a 7 kyu. The 7kyu game leaves me with a bitter aftertaste of 'what if'.

hl782 wrote:Two more ranked games today - 1 win 1 loss - 1 win vs a 8 kyu, and another loss vs a 7 kyu. The 7kyu game leaves me with a bitter aftertaste of 'what if'.

Looks to me as if you can escape with 123. Because of the much-maligned stone at E14, that fixed up your shape. (Yes, the invasion seems premature: you should try to surround the centre first.)

Anyway, Black 123 at E10. White can answer at E11, when you escape easily at G8.

White can also answer at F11. After which Black E11, White E12, and White can't cut at D11?

Really, is an example of a good, thick play.

Other comments: play at M14, but this sort of peep at is deprecated anyway. Both players like fixing the shape, it seems, but that is like a systematic flaw.

is heavy. Think about P10 instead.

I'd play at E17. You are very strong to the right, so struggle harder for the corner.

at K6 would look towards a central strategy. White has conjured up some shape, so you have to be figuring out the big picture.

Incredibly busy with work these days so i hardly have time to play 1-2 games a day now :/

I've had some decent luck in my free games vs 7+ kyus (in fact i beat a 6kyu in an even game!) but in my ranked games, i lost against all of my matches vs 7ks in the past few days i should probably just stop playing free games-_-

attached are my games below for inspection! first are the three wins against an 8kyu (ranked), and 6/7 kyu (free games)

I'll review my defeats in my free time later tonight and then upload them for your comments as well

hl782 wrote:

Game 3. You handled the fighting quite well, especially on the top side, where there was an awkward position.

I was glad to see !

At it is surely possible to come out.

- which side to cut? Here I think the other side first. 123 principle usually applies. Then at you have a better position. Well, connecting at is just slow.

At the same type of decision; and again I would play the other order.

- the timing is out for ''motare''.

gets a good result, well deserved. Comments end.

Still so busy - but yesterday i played 4 games total, lost 3, won 1 x)

Today i played 2 games, won 1, lost 1. It's definitely harder against 7ks for sure but i am getting the hang of it.

And Charles, thanks for the comments. I really do appreciate it all the time

Played 1 game, won 1 game.

Attached are 3 of my recent defeats against 7kyus - any tips and comments would be appreciated - I said i would post reviewed versions up but once again, just too busy these days to do anything more than play a few games a day :/

Don't let yourself get surrounded while taking tiny territories. Conversely, try to surround your opponent and play from the outside. Jump into the center and don't let your opponent press you down.

Play more severely, cut your opponent and fight. Don't respond to his challenges meekly because you fear fighting. If he is trying to start a fight in your area, simply take away his base, play from a distance to surround or force him to run away so your attacking moves can make territory.

Don't play moves that only defend territory. (tied with above tips). Play moves that defend while attacking, or play moves that threaten to create weak groups. Taking away the opponents base is important, and so is establishing a base of your own. But it's equally important to not get pressed down on the side while the opponent builds walls in the center.

When you are strong and your opponent is weak, don't contact play. Take his base potential and while he is running, play moves that attack while taking territory.
When you are weak and your opponent is strong, it is often a good idea to play contact moves. Contact moves help the opponent, but if he is already strong, this doesn't matter.

Also, don't play moves that help your opponent surround territory or push him into the center.

Don't let him build huge areas without invading if there's a big space. I see you automatically assume that an entire side is his territory and contend yourself with pushing along the center helping him surround his own territory. Instead, invade or reduce.

Just some general tips. From what I've seen, you would also benefit greatly from trying to read a couple of moves ahead. (More tsumego! gogo).

Some comments on the last game:

hl782 wrote:Played 1 game, won 1 game.

Attached are 3 of my recent defeats against 7kyus - any tips and comments would be appreciated - I said i would post reviewed versions up but once again, just too busy these days to do anything more than play a few games a day :/

Game 2.

Seems you need some alternate ideas, to improve further.

E.g.

Just play O4 and wait. Is White going to cap at O9? Who knows, but there would be plenty left round here.

Tidy up by capturing at M7. It is "honest", and makes P10 a strong attack.

You don't need a play round here. Consider M10, which might turn the ladder into a net. If you get sente, then C3 is big.