Life In 19x19

Posted: **Sat Nov 12, 2011 5:24 pm**

Magicwand wrote:
gogameguru wrote:
Yes, the peep doesn't look so good now.

The commentary said that the peep (33) was played too late. According to them, the best time to peep was this:

$$Wcm32 The timing of the peep
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . O . X . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 5 . O . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . 2 3 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32 The timing of the peep $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . 5 . O . . O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . 2 3 O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

White said he would've played 36 in that case, giving black time to finish the corner.

even that i dont agree... in above diag..that peep didnt do anything for black.
it made the black's side weaker if any...

@Magicwand

Posted: **Sat Nov 12, 2011 5:27 pm**

Sorry for the slowness. As some of you might've observed, it's been one of those weeks...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm49 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . O . . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . 1 . O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

How would you deal with 51?

Posted: **Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:36 pm**

What's black's next move?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm49 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 4 3 . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . O . . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . 1 . O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Posted: **Sun Nov 20, 2011 10:03 pm**

This is what I'd like to see~

Posted: **Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:25 pm**

@Chew

Right, that's what black wants to do. The only question is can he do it now?

The commentary doesn't talk about this, but here's my analysis:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bc White sacrifices in good form and takes a big point like . $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O 3 2 O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O 1 O 9 . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . 4 X 7 O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 5 O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Pushing at 8 and playing atari everywhere wouldn't really help black.

You'll see in the game that black plays to enlarge the weakness first, mainly to prevent the diagram above from happening.

Posted: **Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:27 pm**

So black still aims at cutting, how can white handle this?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm53 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . 1 X . O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Posted: **Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:59 am**

gogameguru wrote:@Chew
Right, that's what black wants to do. The only question is can he do it now?

The commentary doesn't talk about this, but here's my analysis:

$$Bc White sacrifices in good form and takes a big point like .
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O 3 2 O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O 1 O 9 . X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . 4 X 7 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 5 O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc White sacrifices in good form and takes a big point like . $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O 3 2 O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O 1 O 9 . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . 4 X 7 O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 5 O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Pushing at 8 and playing atari everywhere wouldn't really help black.

You'll see in the game that black plays to enlarge the weakness first, mainly to prevent the diagram above from happening.

Thanks. I seem to worry too much about if I CAN cut, not if I SHOULD.

Posted: **Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:19 am**

Posted: **Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:36 am**

hyperpape wrote:
I think White ends up thick if Black cuts after . I don't really know how to handle though.

$$Bcm53
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . 2 1 X . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm53 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . 2 1 X . O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

@hyperpape

Posted: **Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:41 am**

So this is the game. Similar to hyperpape's diagram, except black decides to cut at 55 first. What happens if white blocks here? What's the alternative?

If you need some ideas, you can look at the two hidden posts above. As is often the case with Go, the next move comes much more naturally when you look at things from the right perspective.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm53 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O 3 O . . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . 2 1 X . O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Posted: **Thu Nov 24, 2011 6:39 am**

Turns out I wasn't reading enough.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm53 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O 5 4 O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 6 O 3 O . . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . 2 1 X 7 O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I'd been thinking of this diagram, which ends up good for White, I think. White ends up thick.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm53 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O X O . | $$ | . . O O X . . . X . O . X . X . . . . | $$ | . . . X X . . . . , . . . . . , O . . | $$ | . O . . . . . . . . O . . . X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X O O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O 5 4 O X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 6 O 3 O . . X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . 2 1 X . O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 0 8 9 O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 . O X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

But black doesn't have to cut :b59:

is better, I think. It's true that white ends up with a wall, but I don't like it as much.

I still can't think of any way around :w56:

or

or

.

Posted: **Sun Nov 27, 2011 4:06 pm**

Well it seems like people aren't that interested in continuing this. Is it because it's boring or because it's too hard? In my opinion, it's not the most exciting game.

What do you all want to do? Continue or not?

Also, does anyone know when gaius is coming back? I thought he said he'd be away for two weeks but it's been 3-4 weeks.

Posted: **Sun Nov 27, 2011 5:04 pm**

I've been following it, but it's a bit above my level to try to read out the sequences - the strategic aims are hard for me to grasp, let alone the local moves.

Posted: **Sun Nov 27, 2011 6:04 pm**

This type of thread often seems to peter out. If you do stop, it would be nice if you could at least post an SGF of the entire game.

Posted: **Mon Nov 28, 2011 2:17 am**

For me it's just heavily time-consuming to come up with an answer, that's why I seldom write here.
It is really interesting to read this position and to reason between possible outcomes and I think it is very beneficial but then again, it takes a lot of time (>1 hour) if I want to be satisfied with my assessment ^^

Life In 19x19

Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!

Re: Guess-the-next-move!