[go]$$Wm68 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . 1 2 . . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X . O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Tough to decide between this hane and the cut, but with the cut if white plays atari as below I don't seem to have a good answer (if I play a then white takes at b and there's no way to kill white inside, if I play b then white breaks through and it's not clear I have enough in the middle). This way is a bit more dangerous (my lower group may get cut off) but it's more complicated and more oriented towards the centre.
$$Wm68 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . 3 . . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . b 2 1 a . . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X . O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Wm68 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . 3 . . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . b 2 1 a . . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X . O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
p.s. Would appreciate any input regarding the previous moves or the current situation. Feel free to ask questions or request clarification as well
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:36 pm
by illluck
A brief comment about move 39 now that I'm looking over the game again:
I'm no longer sure why I played it instead of the second-line extend now - I can't seem to find anything that looks particularly bad after the extend and the game move was so costly in terms of both points and group stability XD
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 5:13 pm
by hyperpape
$$Wm68 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . 3 . O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . 1 2 . . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X . O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Wm68 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . 9 . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . 5 3 8 O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . 1 2 6 7 . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X 4 O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . a O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Whether he has to play is the key point. I don't actually think Black can get anywhere cutting, so in a sense, I should be hoping for that. After the sequence I've shown, I think White is still fine, so I don't really think Black should play it. So I don't really know what I'm hoping for or expecting. I guess it's more of a "I hope I'm not missing something feeling.
On second thought, I think I was missing something, at a.
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 8:08 pm
by hyperpape
$$Wm68 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . 4 3 . O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . 5 1 2 . . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X . O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Wm68 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . 4 3 . O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . 5 1 2 . . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X 6 O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | hol $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
To be honest the situation is outside of my reading ability, so I can't really justify my choice versus alternatives (the rough idea is that I don't like the counteratari if I play an atari, but that may in fact be a better result than this more aggressive connect). I hope to cut white off without leaving too much eyeshape by threatening white's corner, but the corner is quite strong because it has the ability to capture the second line stone and so I'm not sure what will happen XD
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 6:07 pm
by hyperpape
$$Wm68 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . 7 . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . 4 3 . O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . 5 1 2 . . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X 6 O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$W $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . X O 3 O 8 . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . O O X 2 4 5 . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X X O 7 6 . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . 1 X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . 9 . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Lots of very complicated things going on here. Here's a trade that would be awesome (= will never happen)
$$W $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . 7 . 5 3 . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . c 9 8 6 X O 2 O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . b 0 O O X 4 . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O a . O X X O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . 1 X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$W $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . 7 . 5 3 . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . c 9 8 6 X O 2 O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . b 0 O O X 4 . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O a . O X X O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . 1 X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Cute little loose ladder, but should be above , and white loses out then, I think.
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:15 pm
by hyperpape
$$Wm74 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . X O . O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . O O X . . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X X O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Wm74 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . 2 1 . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . X O . O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . O O X . . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X X O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I think this is the only reasonable move. I did consider also the push below, but that feels slightly aji-keshi. I think now I'll probably have to let go of the lower right group if I want to maintain my centre, but I'll have to be careful because if that's captured it will be hard to shut white in.
$$Wm74 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . . O . . X O O O O O X O O X . X . . | $$ | . . . O . . X X X X X O O X X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . | $$ | . O X . X . . . . . . . . 4 1 . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . X O 5 O . . | $$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . O O X 2 3 . . | $$ | . . O X X . X . . O . . O X X O . . . | $$ | . . O X . O . . . X X . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
is the key point. I don't actually think Black can get anywhere cutting, so in a sense, I should be hoping for that. After the sequence I've shown, I think White is still fine, so I don't really think Black should play it. So I don't really know what I'm hoping for or expecting. I guess it's more of a "I hope I'm not missing something feeling.
should be above 
, and white loses out then, I think.