Well, maybe Phelan will make a canceling mistake. That seems to happen a lot more than I would expect...
Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1
Posted: Wed May 12, 2010 5:13 pm
by Magicwand
my plan workout perfectly!!!! i am a Genius!!!! but i will not count my chicken until they hatch!! you never know what you gonna get from our weakest link.
Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1
Posted: Wed May 12, 2010 11:34 pm
by Jordus
So my game breaking sequence mentioned back on move 59 (the one I said I would post later...) ....
Might be better now with violence's 3,3 move into the bottom left corner, but here is what i was thinking at that time. (Board position is from back at move 59....)
$$Bcm $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . 2 . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | 6 1 O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . 4 3 7 . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . 5 8 . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . 9 . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O , . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . 2 . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | 6 1 O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . 4 3 7 . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . 5 8 . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . 9 . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . b a . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . O X . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . O . . . O X X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
or around a or b? hhhmmmmm......
black will probably end up playing for life in the corner and depending on which direction this sequence may become impossible..... though it can get incredibly complicated so maybe not a good one after all...... Originally when I first read this sequence I read the possible ladder incorrectly....
anyways.... just some clarification on an idea I almost forgot to tell you guys about after I said I would....
Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1
Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 3:10 am
by Phelan
$$Wcm78 Move 78 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . O X . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . O . . 1 O X X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm77 Nope, it's a bad alternative $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . 3 . X O . O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X 2 X X O . O X . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . O . . 4 O X X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
But it's wrong.
Expected it is. It even forces Violence to play gote and all
Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1
Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 3:34 pm
by Violence
Bad move... and this is what I get...
Such a simple sequence to capture that stone, are you kidding me?
Feh... Now I'm really annoyed.
If Magicwand keeps playing these annoying overplays, it'll be hard to establish a lead in the game...
At least there's still play here, from what I can read. It's very complicated, but there's room for both sides to make mistakes... which, I'm convinced, after these moves, will undoubtedy happen.
$$Bcm79 Move 79 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X 1 X X O . O X . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . O . . O O X X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm81 Move 81 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X . | $$ | . . 1 O . . . . . , X X X X O . O X . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . O . . O O X X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . W X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
A fairly easy choice for once. Well, we're dead in the corner. Pity that our 4d had to use his move to connect like that. I'm sure magicwand made the right choice with his last move, but my move is awfully big, so I don't feel too bad. I wonder if Jordus has found the other, working sequence now--or if he is thinking he should have tenukied? *resists temptation to look*
hmmm... actually, we're not dead:
$$Bcm81 Move 81 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X X X X O . O X 6 | $$ | . . X . . . . . . O 2 . O O X X O 4 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . W X 1 . 3 5 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm81 Move 81 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X X X X O . O X 6 | $$ | . . X . . . . . . O 2 . O O X X O 4 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . W X 1 . 3 5 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
...unfortunately, I'm pretty sure that kills our side group. Well, that means we can reinforce the side group in sente (threatening this sequence) at some point.
If we're very, very lucky, topazg or phelan will not notice how harmful this for black and spend a move to pommern (look it up at sensei's) us.
Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1
Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 7:24 am
by topazg
$$Wcm82 Move 82 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . , X X X X O . O X . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . O . . O O X X O 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Wcm82 Move 82 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . , X X X X O . O X . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . O . . O O X X O 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
This is one weird game... Firstly, I'm pretty sure my move is necessary to kill the corner, that's good to be a good gain. Secondly, I think it's sente against the edge too:
$$Wcm82 Move 82 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . 3 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . , X X X X O . O X . | $$ | . . X 2 . . . . . O . . O O X X O 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Wcm82 Move 82 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . X | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X 3 . | $$ | . . O . X . . O . . . . X . O . X 4 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . 8 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . 6 5 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X 7 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O X 9 | $$ | . . X O . . . . . , X X X X O . O X . | $$ | . . X 2 . . . . . O . . O O X X O 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Only 1 eye now?
Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1
Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 7:39 am
by daniel_the_smith
Arg, I'm so curious what everyone is saying, haha...
Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1
Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 7:45 am
by Marcus
daniel_the_smith wrote:Arg, I'm so curious what everyone is saying, haha...
Well, topazg made the hiding of the comment pointless, so feel free to read it. And also, let me know why you didn't consider my candidate move? Just curious, I'm not sure what would be correct.
Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1
Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 8:12 am
by daniel_the_smith
That was actually the first move I considered but I managed to read it out completely wrong, oops.
Didn't realize I could capture those three white stones if he didn't defend them, and then when I did later, didn't put 2+2 together. Well, that's a big mistake, I should have double-checked. Violence will think I'm on crack...