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Re: 118. hailthorn vs. Tryphon
Posted: Sun May 08, 2011 12:30 pm
by mw42
$$Wm1
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wm1Clearly this exchange is bad for black as you can see from the tewari,
should be at
which it cannot be.
Re: 118. hailthorn vs. Tryphon
Posted: Sun May 08, 2011 3:44 pm
by Tryphon
$$Bm7
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bm7
It's the first time someone plays 7 in this situation.
$$Bm7
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bm7 B is the most natural and I can't see why it could be wrong.
But my opponent key point is my keypoint, so I'm looking avidly at A. But if I play A, MHO plays B and can make a base, whereas my 2 corner stones become under attack. They'll flee, but then A can be attacked.
So, B.
Posted: Sun May 08, 2011 4:52 pm
by EdLee
Joaz, mw42, (hidden from players until upper left settled),
About the
exchange:
Joaz Banbeck wrote: The above exchange seems ineveitable, and cannot be good for black.
mw42 wrote: Clearly this exchange is bad for black as you can see from the tewari
Local search, pro games -- (a) 23 games (1680 - 2008); (b) 2 games (1974, 1977); (c) 1 game (1963) --
so
(a) is the most common pro move here:
$$Wm6
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wm6
Re:
Posted: Sun May 08, 2011 4:58 pm
by mw42
EdLee wrote: Joaz, mw42, (hidden from players until upper left settled),
Joaz Banbeck wrote: The above exchange seems ineveitable, and cannot be good for black.
mw42 wrote: Clearly this exchange is bad for black as you can see from the tewari
Local search, pro games -- (a) 23 games (1680 - 2008); (b) 2 games (1974, 1977); (c) 1 game (1963) --
so
(a) is the most common pro move here:
$$Wm6
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wm6
Posted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:11 pm
by EdLee
mw42,
mw42 wrote: I bet the global situation is such that a wall on the approached side is good for black's development (as is not the case for this game).
Joaz's analysis was local, and in a few of the pro games, the B move also happened quite early (move 8, move 10, etc.),
so there was no wall to speak of -- here are two:
$$B 2008
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B 2008$$B 2007
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B 2007
Re:
Posted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:21 pm
by mw42
EdLee wrote: mw42,
mw42 wrote: I bet the global situation is such that a wall on the approached side is good for black's development (as is not the case for this game).
Joaz's analysis was local, and in a few of the pro games, the B move also happened quite early (move 8, move 10, etc.),
so there was no wall to speak of:
$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B
Interesting. In this diagram, of the three normal approach moves
$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B(a) and (b) can both be pressed down and allow white to build a wall facing
. So the approach at (c) seems good here. However, I still can't understand the B(a) W(c) exchange so early unless his next move is to continue to press white down on the top at, say, (d). Any input?
Re: 118. hailthorn vs. Tryphon
Posted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:30 pm
by hyperpape
For Tryphon after the game
$$Bm1
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bm1 In this corner pattern, the two space extension is too far. There's no immediate punishment (I asked some time ago, but can't remember where), but the corner has a lot of aji that's not there after playing the one space jump.
a becomes a very nice point for Black to try and get at some point in the future.
Posted: Sun May 08, 2011 7:21 pm
by EdLee
mw42,
mw42 wrote: Any input?
Dunno; maybe check with a pro first?
Re: 118. hailthorn vs. Tryphon
Posted: Mon May 09, 2011 4:47 am
by hailthorn011
$$Bm7
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bm7
Posted: Mon May 09, 2011 4:55 am
by EdLee
hailthorn011,
hailthorn011 wrote: B16 is obviously a move
Maybe either enable co-ordinates, or use markers (I prefer markers
)?
$$Bm7
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bm7
Re: 118. hailthorn vs. Tryphon
Posted: Mon May 09, 2011 2:45 pm
by Tryphon
$$Wm10
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wm10
$$Bm9
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bm9 The move I considered.
- I think he'll answer to a, because of the weakness at z. I prefer a in the 4th line rather than the 3rd because if I play it on the third, the cap will goes well with his already played stones (almost all are on the fourth line)
- b and c are my second favorites, with a preference to b, but no rule to choose between them
- d is likely as good as b and c, but I consider this move to prevent my opponent doing what he wants (I'd be black, I'd love to play sanrensei) rather than to build something I want.
Re: 118. hailthorn vs. Tryphon
Posted: Tue May 10, 2011 7:50 am
by hailthorn011
$$Wm10
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wm10
Re: 118. hailthorn vs. Tryphon
Posted: Tue May 10, 2011 8:34 am
by Tryphon
$$Wm12
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wm12
$$Bm11
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bm11 - Ba Wc Bb is classical but in this case, I'm umconfortable with
- I'm tempted by c, then approach his bottom right corner, that's what I'd play in a normal game, so I'll play that
Re: 118. hailthorn vs. Tryphon
Posted: Tue May 10, 2011 8:46 am
by hailthorn011
I did not see that move coming. -_- Well, there goes all of my plans I had set in mind. Time to rethink!
Re: 118. hailthorn vs. Tryphon
Posted: Thu May 12, 2011 9:35 am
by hailthorn011
Sorry about the wait, Tryphon. I had to think about how I wanted to approach this.
$$Wm12
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wm12
should be at 
which it cannot be. 
exchange:
(a) is the most common pro move here: 
. So the approach at (c) seems good here. However, I still can't understand the B(a) W(c) exchange so early unless his next move is to continue to press white down on the top at, say, (d). Any input?
)?