Agathis floor goban?

[cjsogn]

Hmm.. That doesn't make my choice any easier :p i may have have worded myself badly, but dents are not the biggest concern. I am more worried about cracking, warping and the "tearing away" or wearing of the board. I feel to some degree that the extremely high price i would be paying for Kaya is not fully representing quality, but rather the extremely high demand/availability ratio. So I am thnking that I could get better "quality" for the same amound of money choosing another wood. But to make the question easier: In a most "bang-for-the-buck" kind of way, with mainly durability in mind, what would you rather go for? Budget: (maximum 900 dollars)

1. Kaya + slate n shell
2. Katsura + yunzi
3. Agathis + yunzi

[cjsogn]

Hello again!

For three days now, my wife and I have been staying at a friends place after work playing on his chinese cherrywood floor goban.
While it was not a very pretty thing, it certainly did it's job. But what I have come to realize after these intense
playing days, is that I do not any longer believe neither my wife nor I are made for playing on the floor. We are both quite tall and
stiff(I'm 6'4"), and after playing for such a long time, we both have persisting back pains, numb toes etc. I think I will rather find
her a nice coffetable with fitting chairs for a table goban.

I am placing my order tomorrow morning, and have come down on two choices. After doing some research, and talking to a korean friend,
I have learned that Agathis is the most common korean playing boards and was recommended an ordering site. They are supposedely very hard,
so they do not sound good, but they are very strong. At the same time I have gotten a good deal at KGT for a Kaya table goban with slate and
shell, but at a vastly different price. SO here they are:

1. hon Kaya table goban 6.5cm thick - one piece of wood, cover, outlet slate and shell moon grade with bowls $1150 (including shipping) - KGT
2. Agathis table goban 8.5cm thick - one piece of wood, korean professional agate stones with bowls and cover ~$250 (including shipping) - badukzon.com

So what do you think? Traditional expensive vs new cheap but durable?

[tchan001]

If you want just a common go board that's durable, environmental, and does it's job, bamboo is a good alternative.
But if you are planning to invest in a good board because of you want to show the same love for the game to the love of your equipment, I'd vastly prefer a Japanese crafted kaya table goban with slate and shell stones. A one-piece kaya is a dream. A common agathis is so pedestrian. If you can afford it, go for the kaya.

You can check out my blog post on my one-piece kaya table board if you like. You can also see pictures of it with my thick slate and shell stones on this post.

[cjsogn]

I actually already have seen your equipment, and they are indeed beautiful. But I can't seem to get around the fact that a big part of the price I am paying for it with,
is artificially high because of the lack of Kaya trees and the high demand. And I also dislike that the shell stones seem to get brown with age. After talking to the owner,
he said the Agathis boards are hand made as well and have become high quality due to the fact they are the most used by professionals and in tournaments in Korea. Since kaya had
become so extremely expensive because of the rarity, they had to up the standard of Agathis boards as an alternative to kaya as high grade/quality boards.

But as it stands now I am most likely to go with Kuroki's kaya board, almost solely due to the extreme bueaty of it I am a bit concerned about warping due to the severe climate changes in Norway, with humid hot summers and very dry cold winters. I am also a bit angry about ordering because I know the customs will charge me 25% extra, but I guess it's unavoidable.

[tchan001]

http://www.kurokigoishi.co.jp/english/a ... ecret.html
Read about how to care for a kaya board

[tj86430]

1. hon Kaya table goban 6.5cm thick - one piece of wood, cover, outlet slate and shell moon grade with bowls $1150 (including shipping) - KGT
2. Agathis table goban 8.5cm thick - one piece of wood, korean professional agate stones with bowls and cover ~$250 (including shipping) - badukzon.com

So what do you think? Traditional expensive vs new cheap but durable?

It's a bit like deciding between Mercedes and Hyundai. Both get you from A to B just fine, but if you can afford the Mercedes, it will most certainly give you a better ride (and make your neighbors jealous).

[cjsogn]

I have considered Hiba, but as far as I have read it is very soft and the durability(which i'm perhaps a bit too concerned about) isn't as good as neither, kaya, katsura and agathis.
The same goes for shinkaya i believe. And concerning the Mercedes metaphor, i don't think it's completely translatable. With paying the extra for the mercedes, you actually get a stronger motor, better parts etc as well as a "fancier" car. Kaya and agathis are just two types of wood with different qualities, where one of them is extremely pricey because it's rare and pretty. Although I seem to be falling for it as well

[ez4u]

I don't want to rain on your parade (OK, actually I do or I would not be posting...), however, I have various boards and I would say that my floor board is perhaps the least useful of the bunch. They look nice and I felt great when I bought mine about twenty years ago. Over time though, I find that I just do not use it. As you get older the floor board is harder to use due to back pains and what not. I find that a good table board (in my case a good kaya board) just works better. (Right at the moment I also am enjoying my new bamboo board with yunzi stones , but that is another story.) Also consider what is most likely to be comfortable for visitors who play go with you. This is not just a western thing. Several times a year I go away for a weekend to play go at my friend's weekend house outside of Tokyo. We play on his great grandfather's floor board that is now over 100 years old. But, truth to tell, we play the majority of our games on a 1-inch slotted board at the dining room table because our 58-60 year-old backs can no longer handle the pressure. If you can afford more than one, definitely go for it. You will enjoy it for the rest of your life. Just be aware that if your Go addiction persists, you will likely want an equally nice alternative in the not too distant future!

[tchan001]

I don't want to rain on your parade (OK, actually I do or I would not be posting...), however, I have various boards and I would say that my floor board is perhaps the least useful of the bunch. They look nice and I felt great when I bought mine about twenty years ago. Over time though, I find that I just do not use it. As you get older the floor board is harder to use due to back pains and what not. I find that a good table board (in my case a good kaya board) just works better. (Right at the moment I also am enjoying my new bamboo board with yunzi stones , but that is another story.) Also consider what is most likely to be comfortable for visitors who play go with you. This is not just a western thing. Several times a year I go away for a weekend to play go at my friend's weekend house outside of Tokyo. We play on his great grandfather's floor board that is now over 100 years old. But, truth to tell, we play the majority of our games on a 1-inch slotted board at the dining room table because our 58-60 year-old backs can no longer handle the pressure. If you can afford more than one, definitely go for it. You will enjoy it for the rest of your life. Just be aware that if your Go addiction persists, you will likely want an equally nice alternative in the not too distant future!

You should carefully reread his earlier decision at viewtopic.php?p=80435#p80435

Hello again!

For three days now, my wife and I have been staying at a friends place after work playing on his chinese cherrywood floor goban.
While it was not a very pretty thing, it certainly did it's job. But what I have come to realize after these intense
playing days, is that I do not any longer believe neither my wife nor I are made for playing on the floor. We are both quite tall and
stiff(I'm 6'4"), and after playing for such a long time, we both have persisting back pains, numb toes etc. I think I will rather find
her a nice coffetable with fitting chairs for a table goban.

[schwartzseer]

Call me compulsive, but I tend to favor the same "country of origin" for the board/stones/bowl combinations. Therefore, when I hear you mention Yunzi stones, I immediately think of my single-convex jade-tinted YMI stones, which look very "fitting" with my bamboo table goban, and my mahogany bowls (incised with Mother-of-Pearl still lifes)--together it cries out "Made in China"! If I were to "upgrade" to a rosewood floor goban from YMI that would be even more emphatically Chinese in appearance That said, if you are considering Yunzi, then a question you need to answer is biconvex vs. single-convex, as this in turn dictates the goban (grid spacing on Chinese boards are usually larger than Japanese or Korean, and thus Yunzi stones tend to look "crowded" on non-Chinese gobans).

You also mentioned considering Korean agathis boards; I know on Ebay that a "6 Brothers" two-inch thick agathis goban straight from Korea goes for about US$190 ($130+$60 s/h) [http://www.ebay.com/itm/Baduk-Board-Agathis-Wood-5-5cm-Thickness-6-Brothers-/270482073522?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3ef9fce7b2], but a similar (if not identical one) can be had from Yutopian for US$75+$13 s/h [https://www.yutopian.com/yutop/cat?product=TK110&category=T]. Samarkand (Janice Kim's defunct sales outlet) also carried these agathis boards, stating they were common in Korean baduk academies [http://web.archive.org/web/20040908230248/http://www.samarkand.net/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=10D.html&cart_id=3206674_83612]. The Korean agathis boards tend to have a dark wood stain on the sides, and a "clear wash" on top to even the color of the wood, giving it a beige appearance--but this is not to everyone's tastes. That said, the contrast is pleasing to the eye, and would work especially well with colored JangStone Korean biconvex glass stones--the "Nano Silver" stones (which are not silver, but seaweed and candy apple green, respectively) are available from various sources, but are cheapest at YMI (US$39+ s/h) [http://www.ymimports.com/p-834-jade-color-glass-go-stones-nano-silver-jangstone-85mm-size-30.aspx]. The green color is reputed to be more soothing to the eye, and certainly would be very unique and distinctive in appearance. If you were more traditional, you could get black and white Korean glass stones of varying thicknesses; for example, Yutopian has a set of hefty 10mm Korean stones for US$36+$9 s/h[https://www.yutopian.com/yutop/cat?product=SK215&category=Sg]. As a finishing touch, the Korean mahogany bowls at Yutopian for US$45+$8 s/h [https://www.yutopian.com/yutop/cat?product=BK345&category=B] would match the brown sides of the goban quite well, though if you prefer the Go Seigen style bowls (wider, flatter) then the Lacquered bowls from Yutopian for US$40+$8 s/h might be the ticket [https://www.yutopian.com/yutop/cat?product=BK310&category=B].

Rounding out the "three country tour," YMI carries a Japanese KGT-made Kaya two inch table board for US$600+free s/h [http://www.ymimports.com/c-65-premium-japanese-go-sets.aspx], though YMI seems to no longer carry shell & slate stones separately. In the US Yutopian has a selection of shell & slate which vary greatly in price depending on quality and size (7.5mm "standard grade" is US$170 through 9.8mm "snow grade" at US$680) but you save compared to the various Japanese websites, esp. with regards to shipping [https://www.yutopian.com/yutop/cat?product=SK215&category=Sg].

HTH

DISCLAIMER--I have no connection or financial interest in any stores or web-sites (go or otherwise) other than as a satisfied customer.

[tchan001]

Rounding out the "three country tour," YMI carries a Japanese KGT-made Kaya two inch table board for US$600+free s/h [http://www.ymimports.com/c-65-premium-japanese-go-sets.aspx], though YMI seems to no longer carry shell & slate stones separately. In the US Yutopian has a selection of shell & slate which vary greatly in price depending on quality and size (7.5mm "standard grade" is US$170 through 9.8mm "snow grade" at US$680) but you save compared to the various Japanese websites, esp. with regards to shipping

Something tells me free shipping and handling from Yutopian will probably not apply to orders from Norway.

But as it stands now I am most likely to go with Kuroki's kaya board, almost solely due to the extreme bueaty of it I am a bit concerned about warping due to the severe climate changes in Norway, with humid hot summers and very dry cold winters. I am also a bit angry about ordering because I know the customs will charge me 25% extra, but I guess it's unavoidable.

[chessweiqi]

I don't play go a lot with my plastic go board because no one really plays where I live. I decided to ask my parents for a go board set. The table board is a lot cheaper but you have to pay for shipping, and I can't really play with it except on the table. I could get this... http://jzool.com/en/p/18383-Pedestal-fo ... -Board/482 but it's more than the go board so I don't think it's worth the money for that. I don't want to get an expensive set because I'm asking my parents for it, but I found this... http://jzool.com/en/p/18203-Size-20-Shi ... -Board/357 which means i'll get stones for 70-100 dollars at YMImports. But the main reason I want the go board is so I can get kifus and go books I already have to play them on the go board. The kifu (a collection of one person) costs 100 dollars and I don't want to be too pricey so that I don't get all of them at one time. So should I go for the table board which won't be kaya, or a floor board?

[tchan001]

...which means i'll get stones for 70-100 dollars at YMImports.

If you are ordering only 70-100 dollars from YMImports, you are probably already paying shipping. If you live in the US and your order is over USD125, then shipping is free. So you might consider ordering the whole set from them.

Alternatively, f you are targeting for your parents to spend around USD500-600 [the jzool floor goban you posted is already over USD450 and stones from YMI budgeted at 70 to 100], I'd recommend getting a table goban set from Kurokigoishi.

If you look at their pages for sets available in the following sections, you'll see many sets to choose from:
Best buys of the month
Outlet
For different level players

Write to Kurokigoishi and ask them for their recommendation for the best full set of goban, stones, and bowls including shipping at the budget you think your parents would be ok with. You may be surprised by what they recommend you. Remember that you need to write to them before ordering to ask for the shipping costs for the set you choose if it's just off the pages on the website.

Many people on L19 including myself have had good experience ordering from Kurokigoishi.