Does anyone have thoughts about iLLLuck's joseki choice? I'm never quite satisfied with the relationship between D4 and L3. In this position, I prefer when W goes high and I can play K4,for example.
If a, then Black is has a wider gap at b than he might like. Perhaps that's why I haven't seen in the database.
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:47 pm
by illluck
This is somewhat weird and I hope Hyperpape doesn't mind (if you do, please let me know):
I have a few alternatives that I think are interesting for my next move, would it be possible to ask for a vote (that ends in, say, a day)? If there is a tie (or no responses) I will pick one.
"a": plan to double hane if white plays hane. "Dayaliang" - ancient Chinese joseki (mostly for 3 stone games). "b": drooping lotus, also ancient Chinese joseki. "c": plan jump up from pincer stone if white jumps up. "Jinjinglan" - another ancient Chinese joseki. "d": the typical 4 space low pincer commonly seen in ancient Chinese games :p
Note that I have never studied them in detail (and only used "b" a few times in games), so it should be pretty interesting/hilarious to watch any of them.
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:37 pm
by hyperpape
I don't mind, but do I get a vote?
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:39 pm
by konfuzed
You're right, those are interesting! My vote:
'A' is a favorite of mine, and probably very different for somebody who likes opening with 3-3s.
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:31 pm
by illluck
hyperpape wrote:I don't mind, but do I get a vote?
Sure
Though, I think I should remove C because it's very dependent on a choice for white (and I think sansan probably better than jump up for white).
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:33 pm
by hyperpape
Eh, I didn't look, it was just a joke.
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:36 pm
by illluck
I know, but it's OK to if you are interested as I don't think the choices will affect the game (you'll see the final decision anyways, and other moves don't reveal anything about strategy because they are just interesting possibility not related to each other)
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:50 pm
by jts
These all seem fascinating, but are any of them played by pros in modern times?
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:38 pm
by Redundant
jts wrote:
These all seem fascinating, but are any of them played by pros in modern times?
Option a is particularly fascinating. Depending on the position (i.e. i don't think it's valid here), this joseki has a mistake variation that requires multiple myoshu to find the strongest resistance. I have no idea how it all works now, but shaddy has it in a chinese book he picked up last year.
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 9:07 am
by Celebrir
I would choose 'd'. I won't discuss this decision now because I don't want to make it easy for illuck if he picks one in the case of a tie
So I guess it was a choice between "a" and "d". Both are interesting, but I picked "d" because while I don't remember ever playing either, I've had "a" and then the counterhane played against me a few times. I don't think I've ever seen "d" in my games, so let's try a less common one!
Also, I think "d" is also more open in terms of next choices - would be interesting to see how it affects the rest of the game.
Additionally, the fact that there exists a very nice shoulder-hit reduction on the bottom third-line stone also makes a sequence more focused towards a wall facing bottom less attractive.
Re: #171 Hyperpape vs. illluck
Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:39 pm
by Uberdude
No point hiding this I suppose...
I was a bit surprised to see the most normal (and simple) move not suggested, at e. With a, the normal continuation is the cash-grabbing block. There's some coverage of this and other choices in this lower side shape after the approach in chapter 10 of "A Dictionary of Modern Fuseki: The Korean Style".
I think I'd rather just double approach first. Playing the - exchange just hurts White's chances here, I think. Either of the standard jump into the corner and blocking josekis seem locally worse for Black, and white can always come back for ;w1: if desired.
Diagrams suck, and you people with your hide tags are driving me mad!
in the database.
- 
exchange just hurts White's chances here, I think. Either of the standard jump into the corner and blocking josekis seem locally worse for Black, and white can always come back for ;w1: if desired.