Thanks for sharing your story. It feels nice to know that others have had a similar experience and/or feeling.SoDesuNe wrote:I didn't get a (grade-wise) promotion either, despite getting (literally) excellent performance reviews and even discussing the promotion with my superiors. They told me, they would look into it and later when I asked how it was looking, the relevant partner told me: "He wouldn't know, why the promotion shouldn't go through."
Since I already know him for a couple of years I knew this sentence meant, he has no clue about the status of my promotion-process and mostly he does not care about such things either. But that would been okay, if he actually had entered my promotion into the process. Turns out he didn't.
I'll adress this with my more immediate supervisor after my vacation because I want to know why. If they don't care about my career, I won't care about delivering excellent results, too.
Kirby's Study Journal
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
be immersed
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
OK, enough lamenting about promotions for now. Here's another game.
I played on KGS for the first time in awhile (I've been playing on fox, as you've seen), and it has me at 4d?, somehow. Anyway, that means 5 stones against 2k, which is pretty hard for me - 5 stones is a lot! I feel a little bit bad about this game, because I am pretty sure that the last move my opponent played was a misclick. He asked for undo, just as I played to capture the stones, and then he resigned. I should have been faster to get another undo in or something.
My plans were a little shallow to trick a 2k this game, I guess, and nothing was quite working.
Here is a quick review:
So if the game proceeded, I probably would lose. It just seemed like there were too many stones.
That makes me wonder: how would I have to play differently in order to have a better chance giving 5 stones to a 2k? In this game, my plans had some holes that were too obvious - if you just read a few moves deep, you could find those holes. And he often did, whether explicitly or by intuition. So to win, one hypothesis I have is that I need to have a deeper plan. It can't have holes at the shallow branches, which are easy to find. That means that I can't just play something that I know isn't completely working. I need to search deeper - look deeper for the answer.
My psychological takeaway from this game is: search deeper - don't leave obvious holes in my plan.
I played on KGS for the first time in awhile (I've been playing on fox, as you've seen), and it has me at 4d?, somehow. Anyway, that means 5 stones against 2k, which is pretty hard for me - 5 stones is a lot! I feel a little bit bad about this game, because I am pretty sure that the last move my opponent played was a misclick. He asked for undo, just as I played to capture the stones, and then he resigned. I should have been faster to get another undo in or something.
My plans were a little shallow to trick a 2k this game, I guess, and nothing was quite working.
Here is a quick review:
So if the game proceeded, I probably would lose. It just seemed like there were too many stones.
That makes me wonder: how would I have to play differently in order to have a better chance giving 5 stones to a 2k? In this game, my plans had some holes that were too obvious - if you just read a few moves deep, you could find those holes. And he often did, whether explicitly or by intuition. So to win, one hypothesis I have is that I need to have a deeper plan. It can't have holes at the shallow branches, which are easy to find. That means that I can't just play something that I know isn't completely working. I need to search deeper - look deeper for the answer.
My psychological takeaway from this game is: search deeper - don't leave obvious holes in my plan.
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Bill Spight
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
I think you're on to something there.Kirby wrote:That makes me wonder: how would I have to play differently in order to have a better chance giving 5 stones to a 2k? In this game, my plans had some holes that were too obvious - if you just read a few moves deep, you could find those holes. And he often did, whether explicitly or by intuition. So to win, one hypothesis I have is that I need to have a deeper plan. It can't have holes at the shallow branches, which are easy to find. That means that I can't just play something that I know isn't completely working. I need to search deeper - look deeper for the answer.
My psychological takeaway from this game is: search deeper - don't leave obvious holes in my plan.
I'm not so good at giving handicaps, but I have learned a thing or two. One thing I have noticed in the Elf commentaries on no komi games is how bad, from Elf's point of view, White often plays at the start. It's not just making a small error here or there, like approaching a corner instead of taking the last open corner, but White very quickly can get winrate estimates of 20% or less, and still win the game. That underscores the importance of psychology when giving handicaps. In his 21st century go series Go Seigen says that White's job is to make the game difficult for Black. The bots may not approve, but that's how he played as White, komi or not. Sakata also made the game difficult for his opponent. Go Seigen and Sakata had very different styles, but they both gave their opponents problems to solve. If I understand you correctly, you are saying that the problems you created were too easy for this opponent. FWIW, my impression is that you tried to win the game too quickly. When I was learning go the saying was that White's job in a handicap game was to make the game close. OTOH, the pros seemed to equalize around move 100, so there is that. OC, the pros usually gave inadequate handicaps to amateurs.
For the real thing you want to look at ancient pro vs. pro handicap games.OK, down to specifics, which you should take with a large grain of salt. I am no expert at giving handicaps.
I like
. In response to the boshi, 
, I have three thoughts. 1) Tenuki. 2) Keima. 3) The third line peep, which is what you played. But then, after he connected, you switched to plan 2. I kind of want to play the kosumi on the 2d line to connect up with . If he cuts off 
Black is making difficulties for White, not the other way around, it seems to me.I like
. Black seems to be an influence player. I don't know about
. Do you really have an attack against his four stones on the top side? If you connect up is he going to make territory in the center? Not much, I ween. 
was not on my radar. To attack the top side stones I want to protect the against the cut at 
. After who has difficulties? FWIW, my first thought was actually to attack his four stone string with S-13. Now if he cuts I have a two tempi advantage in the local fight. And I'm White. 
But yeah, my feeling is that you are trying to win too soon, and so end up playing too thinly. As a result, Black can harrass White, and not the other way around.
The Adkins Principle:
At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
— Winona Adkins
Visualize whirled peas.
Everything with love. Stay safe.
At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
— Winona Adkins
Visualize whirled peas.
Everything with love. Stay safe.
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Only reading this because I have insomnia, so I’ll keep it short:
1.) I like S13 - seems stronger
2.) Yes, I meant that I didn’t give him hard enough problems
3.) Your thought that I try to win too fast is something I’ve heard of myself not only for handicap games but also for even games. Inseong says I try to win early on by 20 points or something. In a handicap game this feeling of urgency is amplified since I’m clearly losing.
I don’t know how to solve #3 - I’ve had this problem for years. Maybe I need to try to win by less than 10 or something? Not sure.
1.) I like S13 - seems stronger
2.) Yes, I meant that I didn’t give him hard enough problems
3.) Your thought that I try to win too fast is something I’ve heard of myself not only for handicap games but also for even games. Inseong says I try to win early on by 20 points or something. In a handicap game this feeling of urgency is amplified since I’m clearly losing.
I don’t know how to solve #3 - I’ve had this problem for years. Maybe I need to try to win by less than 10 or something? Not sure.
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Uberdude
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Kirby, to help you not try to win a handi game too quickly I think you need to grok that you only need to win by half a point at the end on move 250. Against a 5 stone weaker player you can quite easily pick up 10+ points in endgame, so being 10 points behind at move 150 is fine. Maybe an example will help, here's a 4 handicap game I played at the club recently against Phil, now 1 kyu but generally 1 dan. Beating him on 4h is tougher than another 1k/1d Matt who likes to fight so gets himself into complex middle-game positions I can out-muscle him, but Phil has quite an annoying "I'll just grab these points and be simple and win cos I started so far ahead right?" style (he's an accountant). This was a tough game, and it felt pretty hopeless around move 126 but at least I had a big space I could attempt to live inside and stake my chances on that. Despite living there (black 178 had an amusing tesuji he missed to break both miais) KataGo showed I was still behind but at least I didn't need to resign and around move 190 finally took the lead when I made my dodgy groups live whilst grabbing big endgame. KataGo is useful for handicap games because the winrate stays super high for black for ages, but you can see the point deficit slowly erroding over the course of the game. You don't need the gradient to be that steep at the start. Have a look at your game against Ryan Li for another example, how many points had he caught up by move 50, 100, 150?
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ez4u
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Everyone has their own experiences and takeaways. Mine is that basically White cannot win a five-stone game. Therefore it is necessary to be patient and create lots of opportunities for Black to lose. Be willing to tenuki. Leave weak stones lying around in expectation that you can handle being attacked later. Of course it is absolutely necessary that you believe In your heart that the handicap is appropriate and that you are that much stronger than your opponent. 
Dave Sigaty
"Short-lived are both the praiser and the praised, and rememberer and the remembered..."
- Marcus Aurelius; Meditations, VIII 21
"Short-lived are both the praiser and the praised, and rememberer and the remembered..."
- Marcus Aurelius; Meditations, VIII 21
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Thanks, Uberdude. This is an excellent post. I like your example game (funny about the accountant point). Your point that I need to get the fact that I only need to win by half a point by move 250 is valid. I think I get worried as the game goes on, because if I'm not ahead *right now*, there's some uncertainty that makes me uncomfortable. I try to deal with that by trying to win too quickly.Uberdude wrote:Kirby, to help you not try to win a handi game too quickly I think you need to grok that you only need to win by half a point at the end on move 250. Against a 5 stone weaker player you can quite easily pick up 10+ points in endgame, so being 10 points behind at move 150 is fine. Maybe an example will help, here's a 4 handicap game I played at the club recently against Phil, now 1 kyu but generally 1 dan. Beating him on 4h is tougher than another 1k/1d Matt who likes to fight so gets himself into complex middle-game positions I can out-muscle him, but Phil has quite an annoying "I'll just grab these points and be simple and win cos I started so far ahead right?" style (he's an accountant). This was a tough game, and it felt pretty hopeless around move 126 but at least I had a big space I could attempt to live inside and stake my chances on that. Despite living there (black 178 had an amusing tesuji he missed to break both miais) KataGo showed I was still behind but at least I didn't need to resign and around move 190 finally took the lead when I made my dodgy groups live whilst grabbing big endgame. KataGo is useful for handicap games because the winrate stays super high for black for ages, but you can see the point deficit slowly erroding over the course of the game. You don't need the gradient to be that steep at the start. Have a look at your game against Ryan Li for another example, how many points had he caught up by move 50, 100, 150?
It makes sense that you can have a gradual gain in a handicap game - gaining in endgame is definitely likely against a weaker opponent. In my case, it might be more worrisome because I sometimes have the same impatience in non-handicap games. I don't know why that is - maybe arrogance? I think I should be ahead of my opponent, so I try to get there quickly, I guess. But in that case, too, your point is still valid - even if I think I'm stronger than someone in an even game, if that's truly the case, I should be able to make gradual gains, and win by the end.
Inseong once told me that the point of yunguseng in Korea is to get the kids to transfer "what they *know*" to "what the *play*". In other words, it's easy to know something in theory, but it's hard to actually play it.
This case of gradual winning seems to be something like that - in theory, I "know" I should be calm. But I don't play it, yet. I suppose I need more practice.
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Thanks, ez4u - makes sense in theory. I just need to get myself to play this way, now.ez4u wrote:Therefore it is necessary to be patient and create lots of opportunities for Black to lose.
That being said, no game today. There was an exceptional situation - I translated a video for Young Sun Yoon's youtube channel (we chat offline about me doing this - thanks for letting me know about it, Uberdude), and it took some of the time I'd normally use to play a game. I submitted the translation, but she still has to approve it before you can see it on the video. Once the translation is up, I'll link to it here.
I did do a handful of go problems at lunch, but nothing too serious today.
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Looks like she published the subtitles. This is just one video in a series, so you may want to watch the others first, when they come out. On the other hand, the video seemed pretty self contained to me.
The content has some double approach variations presented by Choi Cheolhan 9d. You can read the subtitles I put in using the YouTube captioning option.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGulfAyTk-A
The content has some double approach variations presented by Choi Cheolhan 9d. You can read the subtitles I put in using the YouTube captioning option.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGulfAyTk-A
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Today's game:
I totally lost out on the bottom and corner. And it was hard after that. I have to give the guy credit - he seemed stronger than other 3d I play on fox.
I totally lost out on the bottom and corner. And it was hard after that. I have to give the guy credit - he seemed stronger than other 3d I play on fox.
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Highlights...
Position 1
This move, I think, is slow: There is aji of the cut - so if I want to take care of that, I should protect directly. If not, I think I should take a bigger point, like playing on the right. I think the move in the corner is lukewarm and slow.
Position 2 The choice above seems questionable. Maybe blocking the other side is better.
Position 3 The move above seems a bit slow.
Position 4 After white's move there, I should block the corner. I didn't read as well as him here.
---
Overall highlights:
1. still need to work on reading better - this guy saw some sequences that I didn't
2. interestingly, i played slack/slow sometimes. often i play too fast and don't play strong enough. i should find a better balance - play slower when it's effective
Position 1
This move, I think, is slow: There is aji of the cut - so if I want to take care of that, I should protect directly. If not, I think I should take a bigger point, like playing on the right. I think the move in the corner is lukewarm and slow.
Position 2 The choice above seems questionable. Maybe blocking the other side is better.
Position 3 The move above seems a bit slow.
Position 4 After white's move there, I should block the corner. I didn't read as well as him here.
---
Overall highlights:
1. still need to work on reading better - this guy saw some sequences that I didn't
2. interestingly, i played slack/slow sometimes. often i play too fast and don't play strong enough. i should find a better balance - play slower when it's effective
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Today's game:
I think my choice in the top left was questionable. But it's a rather short game to review
I think my choice in the top left was questionable. But it's a rather short game to review
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
highlights
Position 1 I played the move above to resist, since it seemed working. But in retrospect, I don't think the result of just answering is that bad: Is that that bad?
The reason I'm skeptical of the way I played is that the top doesn't seem very good for being developed: After the white capture above, white's corner + left side may be better than what I got on the top. It's hard to call the marked black stones as complete "influence", because white has forcing moves in that area... So it's a little questionable to consider this variation to be better.
---
Takeaway:
1. Sometimes doing the obvious way and not resisting is better. So before resisting, consider what happens when I resist - is it better than simple compliance?
Position 1 I played the move above to resist, since it seemed working. But in retrospect, I don't think the result of just answering is that bad: Is that that bad?
The reason I'm skeptical of the way I played is that the top doesn't seem very good for being developed: After the white capture above, white's corner + left side may be better than what I got on the top. It's hard to call the marked black stones as complete "influence", because white has forcing moves in that area... So it's a little questionable to consider this variation to be better.
---
Takeaway:
1. Sometimes doing the obvious way and not resisting is better. So before resisting, consider what happens when I resist - is it better than simple compliance?
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Today's game, again on fox.
I felt pretty relaxed throughout the game. My opponent played in a very aggressive way.
I felt pretty relaxed throughout the game. My opponent played in a very aggressive way.
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Kirby
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Re: Kirby's Study Journal
Highlights...
Position 1 Above, it's not clear to me whether to just extend, or to push up. Both have some merits: My thought is that pushing is probably worse due to white's counter at the marked spot.
So maybe this one: But I'm not 100% sure.
Position 2 Above, I didn't consider what would happen if white tries to split: At the very least, I'd be more uncomfortable.
Here is considerable: But it feels like white is getting a better deal with the territory...
Not sure.
Position 3 Shown above is my move of shame. Don't do that!
Position 4
I don't know how to kill white here: My thought is that *maybe* I could consider just descending: My hane might have helped him... Not sure.
---
Takeaways:
* I don't have that much today - game went pretty much as expected. I think my peep was pretty sloppy, and I didn't concentrate enough when trying to kill the top group... So maybe I should still focus on more precision in reading.
Position 1 Above, it's not clear to me whether to just extend, or to push up. Both have some merits: My thought is that pushing is probably worse due to white's counter at the marked spot.
So maybe this one: But I'm not 100% sure.
Position 2 Above, I didn't consider what would happen if white tries to split: At the very least, I'd be more uncomfortable.
Here is considerable: But it feels like white is getting a better deal with the territory...
Not sure.
Position 3 Shown above is my move of shame. Don't do that!
Position 4
I don't know how to kill white here: My thought is that *maybe* I could consider just descending: My hane might have helped him... Not sure.
---
Takeaways:
* I don't have that much today - game went pretty much as expected. I think my peep was pretty sloppy, and I didn't concentrate enough when trying to kill the top group... So maybe I should still focus on more precision in reading.
be immersed