56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

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quantumf
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by quantumf »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O 7 . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . 2 W X 5 8 O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . 3 1 4 9 X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . 6 O 0 . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


What group is Violence talking about sacrificing? A black group? A white group? I don't see how white can prevent this sequence (11 at E10, or possibly G9, then E10)
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Joaz Banbeck »

quantumf wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O 7 . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . 2 W X 5 8 O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . 3 1 4 9 X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . 6 O 0 . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


What group is Violence talking about sacrificing? A black group? A white group? I don't see how white can prevent this sequence (11 at E10, or possibly G9, then E10)


Violence will play 2 at D7.
Help make L19 more organized. Make an index: https://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5207
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O . . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . B . . X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

sorry for the wait
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by quantumf »

Joaz Banbeck wrote:
quantumf wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O 7 . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . 2 W X 5 8 O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . 3 1 4 9 X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . 6 O 0 . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


What group is Violence talking about sacrificing? A black group? A white group? I don't see how white can prevent this sequence (11 at E10, or possibly G9, then E10)


Violence will play 2 at D7.

And how will he answer E8?
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by fwiffo »

F9?
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

No problem, take your time, I have a lot of work to do too.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O . . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X W . X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Reading............

I think this is the only way to play. If I extend or atari on top, my result is awful.
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O . . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . B . X . . O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by quantumf »

fwiffo wrote:
F9?


Sure, but then black captures the white stone and there's no kill. And white loses by many. Anyway, I must have missed something, because black has captured the stone in the meantime.
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O . . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X W . O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . 2 O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O . . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X 1 . O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Man... I was hoping he would play this way. I think this is good for white.
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O B . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O . . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X O . O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
i wanna make sure i get two stones.. they are bigger than my 5 stones he captured.
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The greater the unknown"

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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by zinger »

Magicwand wrote:i wanna make sure i get two stones.. they are bigger than my 5 stones he captured.

I don't understand this at all.
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1 : something causing or meant to cause interest, surprise, or shock
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by gaius »

zinger wrote:
Magicwand wrote:i wanna make sure i get two stones.. they are bigger than my 5 stones he captured.

I don't understand this at all.

Seems like he's reading somewhat optimistically... His move is a ladderbreaker to capture the two white stones in the centre definitely. However, before this move, black's ponnuki in the corner was already potentially ko for life, but after white answers this, he can just outright kill the top left corner next.
My name is Gijs, from Utrecht, NL.

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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

Sorry about this. I'm really busy at work this week. I'll try to play a move soon.
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X W O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O . . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X O . O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Man, this is complicated... I think I can get a sente ladder breaker... or profit from him capturing two stones in the center.

Not sure what I think about this position, I dunno who's ahead right now.
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X 3 O . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | . X W O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | . O 2 . . . . . . . . . X O X O X O . |
$$ | . 1 O X . . . . . . . . . . O O O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . X O X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X O O . . X X O . X X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X . X O . O O O . O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X . O . O . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
i wonder how he is going to use ladder breaker.
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The greater the unknown"

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