Page 13 of 16

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 5:12 pm
by yithril
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm121 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . 7 . O . . . X . X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 5:18 pm
by Kirby
yithril wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm121 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . , . X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . O . X . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



Was this the correct move in this situation? Maybe there is a weakness in the corner, but is this the best way to protect it? Something makes me feel weird about playing this move as black.

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 5:32 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm121 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X . X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . 8 . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 5:35 pm
by Joaz Banbeck
Kirby wrote:
yithril wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm121 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . , . X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . O . X . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



Was this the correct move in this situation? Maybe there is a weakness in the corner, but is this the best way to protect it? Something makes me feel weird about playing this move as black.


It turns a sente-by-white endgame play at T4 into a gote-by-white play. It precludes all possible invasions. When you are up by 20+ points, it is best to play safe.

BTW, I think that the clamp at S2 would become a ko if black did not play something.

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 5:40 pm
by Kirby
I guess it just seems like a weird shape to me. I don't have any rationale, really, for thinking that it is wrong... Except maybe that it makes some of the other stones look unnecessary (maybe R5, for example).

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:03 pm
by yithril
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm121 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | 9 . . . . . X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X . X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Okay. Center isn't that big.

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:17 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm121 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . . X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . 0 . O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X . X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:22 pm
by yithril
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm131 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . . X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . O . O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . 1 . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X . X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


We already know how this sequence ends.

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:26 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm131 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . 4 X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . 2 O 3 O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X . X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:35 pm
by yithril
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm131 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . O X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O O X O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X 5 X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


20 points ahead.

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:37 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm131 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . O X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O O X O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X X X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:43 pm
by yithril
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm141 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . O X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O O X O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X X X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O 1 O X X . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm131 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . O X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O O X O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X X X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O 9 O X 7 . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O 8 . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Lemme know which one.

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:46 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm131 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . O X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O O X O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X X X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O X O X X . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . 0 . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:49 pm
by yithril
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm141 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . O X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O O X O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . O X O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X X X X X . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O X O X X . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . O 1 5 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 4 2 3 . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: Magic Wand vs. Yithril

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:56 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm141 PRISONERS B:6 W:5
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O O O X X . . . O . X . . |
$$ | X . . . . O X X X X O O O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O O X O O . O X X X , X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . O X O O X O . 6 . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X X X X X . X . 4 5 . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . X . X O 2 O X . . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . . . O X O . . 3 X . . |
$$ | . . X O X . . . . . O . . O X O X X . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . , . O O X X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . O . O X X . X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X O X X O . O X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . O . O . O O O . O O O . |
$$ | . X O . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X . X . X . X . |
$$ | . . X O . O . . . O O . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . O 1 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]