Not sure why black is doing this. I'm ignoring his ladder breaker no matter what, so making it bigger doesn't help, and he's not gaining from this exchange, as far as I can see.
Meh. this ladder breaker isn't too bad for me. It could transpose into a 3-3 invasion. I debated trading a ladder breaker of my own, but my hands would be tied in the local fight.
I chose this way of killing the ladder because it leaves black with worse shape on the top.
Note that black still had forcing moves at k18 and b16.
I'm going for sabaki here. I rejected P3, because after the connection at r4, black has very nice thickness, and white is still liable to be bullied. I also didn't like the crosscut, because after black ataris down with r5 and s5, white will be taking a small corner, and black gets good influence down the right.
I left my last few posts blank because up until now, it's been a very standard sequence. My goal is to keep sente in order to extend from a hoshi stone and perhaps build up a small framework.
A common san san under 4-4 transposition. Due to the weakness in blacks wall, a black move at A is big. I can't expect to retain sente in this variation.
If white 2, then black 3. Black is thick enough in the corner to tenuki and 3 is a nice dual purpose extension/pincer. If my opponent was willing to play this however, I expect that white would have played at p3 in the first place.
This seems reasonable for both players. White gets out with a safe group but the damage to his corner has been done and black fit in his extension from d4.
Solid, thick. I don't want to give black forcing moves here. My group isn't unassailable, but it's not going to be a burden in the near future.
I'm fine with this result from the ladder breaker. Black could have gone for sealing me into the corner with the other hane, and gotten great influence.
Re: 92: Emerus (4k) vs. Redundant (1k)
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 2:23 pm
by emerus
$$Wcm1 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . X . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X X O O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O X O . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O O X O X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . X O X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . B . . . . O O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . X . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X X O O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O X O . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O O X O X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . X O X O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . B . . . . O O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I think the variation in my last post might be a little better for white.
Re: 92: Emerus (4k) vs. Redundant (1k)
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:03 pm
by Mnemonic
@Redundant
Redundant wrote:
I'm going for sabaki here. I rejected P3, because after the connection at r4, black has very nice thickness, and white is still liable to be bullied. I also didn't like the crosscut, because after black ataris down with r5 and s5, white will be taking a small corner, and black gets good influence down the right.
Sensei's Library doesn't give a very precise definition of Sabaki (although it admits it's kinda hard). What would you define sabaki as? Is it just playing weird moves, hoping to spot a Tesuji/hoping that the opponent messes up so that you get a favorable position from an unfavorable start?
Re: 92: Emerus (4k) vs. Redundant (1k)
Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 3:26 am
by Loons
For mnemonic:
I would describe sabaki as tactics used when out-numbered or out-muscled locally, especially characterized by a willingness to sacrifice some stones to gain a flexible shape with others. Black`s connection is not sabaki as he can no longer afford to lose any of the stones. If black`s next move does not fix those stones (eg by forming a base, which is very very likely) then his sequence will be described as "heavy" (where 'light' and 'sabaki' mean the same or similar).
Very relatedly, for Redundant:
Could you describe the sort of sabaki sequence you were anticipating? (After your connection I doubt anything local is going to be called sabaki...)
Solid, thick. My group isn't unassailable, but it's not going to be a burden in the near future.
W's shape after does not feel thick at all; it feels heavy, exactly the opposite of W's original intention of playing sabaki.
It is immediately a burden. In the game B played (a), but maybe a tighter pincer like or (b) is more severe and even better.
Re: 92: Emerus (4k) vs. Redundant (1k)
Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:47 am
by Shaddy
Loons wrote:For mnemonic:
I would describe sabaki as tactics used when out-numbered or out-muscled locally, especially characterized by a willingness to sacrifice some stones to gain a flexible shape with others. Black`s connection is not sabaki as he can no longer afford to lose any of the stones. If black`s next move does not fix those stones (eg by forming a base, which is very very likely) then his sequence will be described as "heavy" (where 'light' and 'sabaki' mean the same or similar).
Very relatedly, for Redundant:
Could you describe the sort of sabaki sequence you were anticipating? (After your connection I doubt anything local is going to be called sabaki...)
Could you describe the sort of sabaki sequence you were anticipating? (After your connection I doubt anything local is going to be called sabaki...)
[/hide][/quote]
Also to Shaddy
[hide][sgf-full](;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[0.00]
GN[A precut diagram]DT[2011-01-11]PC[http://lifein19x19.com/]AW[op][pq]AB[pp][qq]C[Diagram from http://lifein19x19.com/
A precut diagram]PL[W]
;C[My biggest idea is to not get sealed into the corner, and not to give him good influence.]
(;B[oq]
;W[pr]
;B[or]
;W[qp]
;B[po]
;W[qr]
;B[rq]
;W[qo]
(;B[rr]
;W[pn]
;B[oo]
;W[on]
;B[no]
;W[pj]C[I'm fine with this result. The cut at r6 is gote for black.])
(;B[qn]
;W[np]C[Black is burdened with dealing with the q6 ladder, which works for me. He also has to worry about the p2 stones, and the r3 stones.]))
(;B[oq]
;W[pr]
;B[qr]
;W[po]
;B[qp]
;W[nq]
;B[or]
;W[nr]
;B[ps]
;W[nn]))[/sgf-full][/hide]
Also to Shaddy
[hide][sgf-full](;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[0.00]
GN[A precut diagram]DT[2011-01-11]PC[http://lifein19x19.com/]AW[op][pq]AB[pp][qq]C[Diagram from http://lifein19x19.com/
A precut diagram]PL[W]
;C[My biggest idea is to not get sealed into the corner, and not to give him good influence.]
(;B[oq]
;W[pr]
;B[or]
;W[qp]
;B[po]
;W[qr]
;B[rq]
;W[qo]
(;B[rr]
;W[pn]
;B[oo]
;W[on]
;B[no]
;W[pj]C[I'm fine with this result. The cut at r6 is gote for black.])
(;B[qn]
;W[np]C[Black is burdened with dealing with the q6 ladder, which works for me. He also has to worry about the p2 stones, and the r3 stones.]))
(;B[oq]
;W[pr]
;B[qr]
;W[po]
;B[qp]
;W[nq]
;B[or]
;W[nr]
;B[ps]
;W[nn]))[/sgf-full][/hide][/go]
does not feel thick at all; it feels heavy, exactly the opposite of W's original intention of playing sabaki.
or (b) is more severe and even better.