Knotwilg's practice

[pwaldron]

In my own personal experience, I may get some nice ideas and shapes from pro games but it's amazing how it only takes a few moves from a player who is much stronger in reading to send me floundering.

Good point.

Playing good moves comes in (at least) three parts: (i) finding candidate moves, (ii) reading the result of candidate moves, and (iii) evaluating the results of the reading. Playing through pro games is going help with the first part, but won't help much with the second.

[John Fairbairn]

Playing through pro games is going help with the first part, but won't help much with the second.

I'm inclined to disagree. You see the main line of reading when playing over the game, and over time you see similar positions which may or may not follow the same path. At the very least you get a head start with the reading. You're not just getting candidate moves; you are getting candidate sequences.

It seems to me a bit like piano fingering. It's painfully tricky at first, but then you get a flow while reading the music, and then - magic - you can play a tune by ear, your fingers just moving by themselves.

[Kirby]

Once the opponent deviates from the sequence you have practiced, you must come up with a response. This is part of reading.

I think it's obvious that all of the following are helpful (this list is probably incomplete):

- Reviewing high level games and/or joseki
- Playing and reviewing your own games
- Life and death problems

All three of these strategies have been recommended by pros, and all have value.

I would venture to hypothesize that ignoring any one of these categories is suboptimal at some point in your go studying career.

[Knotwilg]

If you want to improve at anything then you need to pick up on what you are doing wrong and fix that. There isn't much more to it.

I agree that getting rid of your mistakes is part of the improvement cycle, but not the only aspect.

Eradicating blunders doesn't even need much review, it "merely" requires to concentrate while playing, use the time you have and that of your opponent to focus on the board, consider a couple of alternatives each time and be aware of liberties, especially towards the end of the game. All of this adds up to "playing at the level of your understanding". You will know you have achieved this if the review (with AI) doesn't show any mistakes which you can easily spot yourself, only interesting, "new", insights to learn from. This doesn't necessarily mean there are no big fluctuations in the AI's game evaluation: big fights can be very difficult and choosing the wrong option makes for big swings.

If you are able to play at the level of your understanding, improving your understanding of the game is going to pay dividends. If you're not, then it will rather add to the current frustration.

Better understanding comes from aforementioned review but also from activities like replaying pro games (predictive, with instant feedback) or studying corner patterns (often recurring in games, so with presumable short term effect), or reading upon and practicing endgame techniques, ... or any aspect of the game. As said, such study won't translate to results immediately and requires the ability to convert understanding into playing strength.

A special note can be given to tsumego because it will achieve two things: acquire intuition about local positions and vital points, and build a higher capacity for reading, which will help in the first job of playing to your level of understanding.

Much of the frustration with amateurs' lack of progress comes from a weak link between their study and their game results. People sensitive to such immediate feedback, better choose a deliberate practice with a strong immediate link to game results. And I think that's what the video kvasir linked to talks about.

[Kirby]

Distinguishing between "blunders" and "better understanding" is useful.

However, from the context of "picking up on what you are doing wrong and fixing that", both categories could fit - gaining a better understanding of the game is one way to stop doing what you are doing wrong.

I think this underscores the fact that various methods are applicable to improvement.

[kvasir]

The argument in the video could possibly be rephrased:

If you are making mistake A in most games then it probably won't help you as much to improve to learn about thing B instead of fixing mistake A. The reason why most people never improve is that they are always chasing after some thing B instead of fixing mistake A.

In Chess "mistake A" for most people are blunders that lose material, most people being very poor chess players in the greater scope of things. Chess players seem to argue over how far it would take someone if they stopped hanging pieces, but that is maybe taking it too seriously because no one is ever going to only improve in this one aspect without learning anything else.

The poker example also seems good. You can only improve if you analyze your play, not just one or two hands but every hand. I think the point here was to take a holistic view, not get bogged down on single mistakes or bad luck.

Similar examples, but with different flavors, could be made in different contexts. I think the key thing is to be looking at what one's actual mistakes are, and depending on context you need to replace the word "mistake" with something else because, for example, a runner doesn't really make mistakes (or maybe they do) but can still improve their technique and form.

I agree that getting rid of your mistakes is part of the improvement cycle, but not the only aspect.

[...]

Much of the frustration with amateurs' lack of progress comes from a weak link between their study and their game results. People sensitive to such immediate feedback, better choose a deliberate practice with a strong immediate link to game results. And I think that's what the video kvasir linked to talks about.

I agree. I'll add that to me it is also the question of what the main activity in the improvement cycle is and I'd say that is really not the other things (i.e. tsumego, memorization, ...), and it is not actually the analysis of your own games, it is the determination to not make the same mistakes again and also the practice when you play games and try to avoid these mistakes. Maybe this is not exactly what the video said but my own thinking instead. That said, tsumego and memorization of certain things does hugely improve results. It is really not one or the other, to me it is about what is the main activity.

Maybe I am repeating myself by now but I also like the point made in the video about mistakes usually not being something that people don't know are mistakes. I think it is easy to forget that we still make a lot of mistakes that are something we already understand. I think especially in Go this is the case because it is such a long game. It is true that this doesn't take much analysis but still, when we do this in every game it seems important for improving and it takes lot of practice to overcome.

[Knotwilg]

Since this is a vanity thread anyway, I will post it here. This week I want to exercise discipline. I've been struggling with various bad habits and like many have made many vain attempts to get rid of them. They include

- staying up late (1-2 AM)
- being on the computer all the time
- drinking alcohol (not a lot but almost every day)
- eating sugar

I'd like to test what it does to my body and mind if I skip all of that during 1 week. I've prepared for it:

- I will go to bed AT midnight
- in the evening, I close my laptop; I have planned a specific non-computer activity each night
- when feeling the urge to drink alcohol, I will drink water instead
- likewise, I'll take a carrot when the desire for chocolate creeps up on me

I'll let you (or myself) know how it went, next Monday.

[Kirby]

Good luck. I think this kind of discipline will have positive side effects that are hard to directly measure.

[Kirby]

How is your week going so far?

[Knotwilg]

How is your week going so far?

I was planning to report out after 1 week but responded to your kind interest!
Here are the stats:

Alcohol V V V
Sugar V V X (one chocolate bar on Wednesday)
Early bed V X V* (after one sleepless night going to bed early, and then a cheat, I moved up my bedtime to 1AM)
Computer V V* V* (I did use the computer but for useful purposes, not procrastinating)

The impact on weight is already noticeable (dropped 2 kilos from the weekend). The craving for sugar and alcohol is there but they seem progressively easier to resist. Not touching the computer has been fairly easy since I went practicing table tennis instead on Tue & Wed, and on Mon I watched Netflix with my wife (which is a "good" activity).
Towards the future I think the biggest challenge will be changing the bedtime hour and getting enough sleep. The urge to procrastinate at night instead of getting enough sleep has a deeper cause than just a bad habit.

[Knotwilg]

Today I completed another completely unrelated challenge: learning the periodic table of chemical elements by heart, all 118.

I'll first prove it to myself by spelling it out here (as a "proof" for you, I won't have all the abbreviations correct).

H He
Li Be B C N O F Ne
Na Mg Al Si P S Cl Ar
K Ca Sc Va Ti Cr Mn Fe Co Ni Cu Sn Ga Ge As Se Br Xe
Rb Sr Y Zr Nb Md Tc Ru Ro Pd Ag Cd In Zn An Te I Kr
Cs Ba Lt* Hf Ta W Rn Os Ir Pt u Hg Th Pb Bi Pn As Rn
Fr Ra Ac* Rf Db Sb Bo Hs Mt Ds Rg Cp Nh Fv Ms Lv Ts Og

Lantanides: Lt Ce Pr Nd Pm Sa Eu Ga Tb Dp Ho Er Th Yb Lc
Actinides: Ac To Pc U Np Pt Am Ci Bk Cf Ei Fm Ml No Lw

Then, an interesting observation. In university I knew the table by heart up until line 3. For that line, we had a mnemonic device using foul language on our lecturers of the time. Since I have memorized the rest of the table by no other device than "synestesy", a kind of intrinsic capacity to connect numbers to something else, that 3rd line now comes slowest because I remember it as a whole have to reverse the punchline to the abbreviations while counting. All other elements are now more strongly linked to their atomic number.

[xela]

...various bad habits...

I can't help wondering if there are some "XY problems" here.

- Eating less sugar, eating fewer chocolate bars, consuming fewer calories, losing weight are four different things. Suggestion: develop a taste for dark chocolate, the darker the better. Personally, I find that if something is at least 70% cocoa, then eating 20 grams will satisfy my cravings for chocolate, which is healthier than a whole chocolate bar or piece of cake.

- Going to bed earlier and getting more sleep are two different things. Going to bed earlier only helps if you *fall asleep* earlier. Google "sleep hygiene" for some hints (most of which don't work for me, but they work for many people, so you might be more fortunate). Another way to get more sleep is to get out of bed later (this may or may not be acceptable depending on your circumstances).

[Kirby]

How is your week going so far?

I was planning to report out after 1 week but responded to your kind interest!
Here are the stats:

Alcohol V V V
Sugar V V X (one chocolate bar on Wednesday)
Early bed V X V* (after one sleepless night going to bed early, and then a cheat, I moved up my bedtime to 1AM)
Computer V V* V* (I did use the computer but for useful purposes, not procrastinating)

The impact on weight is already noticeable (dropped 2 kilos from the weekend). The craving for sugar and alcohol is there but they seem progressively easier to resist. Not touching the computer has been fairly easy since I went practicing table tennis instead on Tue & Wed, and on Mon I watched Netflix with my wife (which is a "good" activity).
Towards the future I think the biggest challenge will be changing the bedtime hour and getting enough sleep. The urge to procrastinate at night instead of getting enough sleep has a deeper cause than just a bad habit.

Very nice! I asked midweek, just to check in

I think the effort is admirable. I should do something similar with alcohol. I don't drink every day, and sometimes not even weekly. But when I do drink, I drink somewhat heavily. Folks who I've met at the US Go Congress probably know this.

I would like to have better moderation for the times I do choose to drink... But in the moment, sometimes I don't seem to want that, too.

It's typically fun when I drink a good amount, but it certainly doesn't seem healthy.

[Kirby]

Today I completed another completely unrelated challenge: learning the periodic table of chemical elements by heart, all 118.

Nice! Was there a particular motivator to drive you to memorize this, or was it just for fun?

[Knotwilg]

Today I completed another completely unrelated challenge: learning the periodic table of chemical elements by heart, all 118.

Nice! Was there a particular motivator to drive you to memorize this, or was it just for fun?

A couple of motivations: 1) I'm member of a quiz team playing in a competition. We're all allrounders but I'm assuming the role of "science expert". 2) We have dementia running in the family and I'm cherishing the illusion that exercise will hold if off 3) I often do such things for fun. Once I learnt a Polish poem by heart, with correct pronunciation and all. I can still do it, especially when meeting Polish people, for jawdropping effect. The periodic table is a less impressive feat but still somewhat "intellectually" rewarding.

These days I'm learning to play both solos in Sultans of Swing. For the poor guitar player I am, that's quite a challenge. It's very unlikely I will ever be able to play it at actual speed (148 bpm). Solo 1 I can play at around 120. Solo 2 only at around 80. It will take a lot of time.