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Re: Invading the corner

Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:28 pm
by speedchase
countsheep wrote:
hyperpape wrote:Interesting perspective. But what about


In your diagrams, invading san-san is a good choice.

no it isn't. especially not in the last one.

Re: Invading the corner

Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:45 pm
by countsheep
Uberdude wrote:Right, the inefficiency is already a good result for you. They aren't something you need to find a follow-up for to take advantage, you already have one.


Yes, I agree with you. Go is a zero-sum game, it's all about efficiency. If you have a higher efficiency, the territory comes with you. And that's why people like the good shapes and hate the bad ones.

speedchase wrote:no it isn't. especially not in the last one.


I said 33 invasion is a good choice, but I don't mean it's the only choice. And, I said it's all about local.
Let's just talk about the last diagram. Maybe you think white should kakari and play like this. What do you think about this diagram?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . a O . . W X . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . X , . . . W . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Actually, locally the result is bad for white. We all know, with the two circle marked stones, w should extend a. But in this diagram white can only play a two space extension. So white is an inefficient shape.
Why so many people play this diagram? That's because, white wanted to break black's moyo, or the moyo in potential. With the white group on the top, black can't make a moyo. That's the whole board thinking. It means the diagram is locally bad, but maybe globally good.
So, locally, 33 is still a good choice. But if you are worried about the moyo, you can kakari and play the diagram above.