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Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2014 8:44 am
by The Intrepid
Sorry for not playing a move. I'll be returning to Go in July, so I plan on resuming this game within the next several weeks.

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 11:43 pm
by The Intrepid
Hey, TIM82! If you still wish to continue this game, I'm all for it. :)

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm27
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O 1 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Trigger accepted.

I haven't looked at this position for awhile, but it looks very interesting! :) My original intention was to play a moyo game. A moyo is more difficult to achieve with white (that is, without giving up the advantage to the other player), so the moyo has to appear "naturally." This can take several forms. For instance, I can keep offering exchanges (in particular, corner or side josekis) where I always seek to take the outside. The other player may wish to resist this by insisting on taking the outside himself, but the idea is that this would be an unfavorable exchange for him. In other words, if he were to try taking the outside, he would put me in the lead, even though I wouldn't be able to get a moyo.

Another way to get a moyo "naturally" is by attacking (and, hopefully, chasing) a weak group. This is the approach I hope to utilize in the present game position. I will attack the group on the left and also, hopefully, the cutting stone :b27:. A great outcome for me would be if I could force black to live small on the left side or to force black to run with that group into the center while I build influence around it on both sides.

For my :w28: move, I also had the choice to play the following.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm27
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O 1 3 . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I rejected this choice because, although I could attack Black on the left side more severely, the cutting group :b27: would become significantly stronger than at present (which would also significantly reduce the aji from my two stones at the top) and so would make the cutting group almost impervious to attack.

Given that I did not play at G13, Black needs to decide if he can afford to play there himself or if he has to defend on the left side, first. Stated differently, if Black plays G13 next, will I be forced to connect at F13 or will I be able to hane at E11 with profit?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm29
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . a 1 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . b . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 2:35 am
by TIM82
I had forgotten this altogether in meantime. Good that the forum send a notification of your message. :-) I'll try to get back to this, need to collect my thoughts first though.

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 1:32 am
by TIM82
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm23
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . 3 2 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O 4 5 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I have to admit I have no idea what Plans I may have had. Really dont want to give the point a took with :b29: to white though, and I think it should be possible to handle the left side after following expected exchange, although it does not look pretty

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm23
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . 3 2 9 . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O 4 5 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . 8 7 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , a . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 11:01 am
by The Intrepid
I'll need to think here some more. By the way, feel free to view follow my other "Takemiya" game at will. :)
I probably have to connect. The hane, although very complicated, probably doesn't quite work, but I'll double-check.

On an unrelated issue, I briefly looked through the earlier moves in the game, and I don't agree with my 18 move anymore. I should have pincerred then, gotten a stable group, and sought to enlarge the moyo on the left/bottom from there. Oh well, past is the past.

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 8:11 am
by The Intrepid
Maybe I can hane at E11 after all. :study: :study: :study:

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2016 2:21 am
by The Intrepid
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm29
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . 2 1 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

If I haned, I could not see how to keep my position together after the following sequence, and so the move in the game was forced.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X 5 4 2 X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . 3 X O . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . 6 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2016 4:51 am
by TIM82
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm29
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O 3 . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . 2 1 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2016 3:50 pm
by The Intrepid
Given Black's move, the question becomes: how severely can I attack the Black group on the left? I definitely shouldn't be able to kill it. Instead, my goal will be to force it to either run into the center or seek small confined life on the left edge. Ideally, I'll be able to do this in sente, such that I get the chance to play first in the top right corner.