what to do what to do... I really want to try to connect to that single black stone(a and b are some ideas)... but it is sooo complicated if even possible... I know I don:t want to play at (d) for sure... letting white run up that way is bad... huge moyo for white then... Running black up with z might be ok... not sure I like that either though... Could always play a big point in all that empty space in the board... eh... what to do what to do...
$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . z . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O d . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . b a . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O . . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , . . . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , a . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O . . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , 7 . . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I still think this is the way to go. We get some much needed eye-space, and in sente since we threated to save our lone stone on the side. We're fairly safe after this, maybe we can talk a point like a?
Re: Teamovitch #1
Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:07 pm
by Joaz Banbeck
Again, I'm going to play without waiting for other suggestions because it is the only move.
$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O . . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , 7 . . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . . , . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O 8 . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , 7 . . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
@Team:
Thanks Red and TJ, me too
Re: Teamovitch #1
Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 10:57 pm
by Jordus
black internal chat:
ok now that we have miai, I refer back to my last internal chat items... diagram edited for recent moves...
Jordus wrote:Black internal chat [hide]what to do what to do... I really want to try to connect to that single black stone(a and b are some ideas)... but it is sooo complicated if even possible... I know I don:t want to play at (d) for sure... letting white run up that way is bad... huge moyo for white then... Running black up with z might be ok... not sure I like that either though... Could always play a big point in all that empty space in the board... eh... what to do what to do...
$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . z . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O d . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . b a . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O O . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , X . . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , 9 . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . Z O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . . , . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . B . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O O . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , X . . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I don't think white is going to play a gote move to neutralize right now, so trying to use the aji right now seems premature. My suggestion feels big, taking fourth line territory. It also relates to the ladder in the middle, so may be helpful if we decide to rescue the cutting stone .
Re: Teamovitch #1
Posted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 4:26 pm
by Joaz Banbeck
BIC / @Fwiffo:
I like your style. But are you absolutely sure that we have eyes in the lower right?
Re: Teamovitch #1
Posted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:13 pm
by fwiffo
Black internal chat:
Well, it sure feels weird to have two open sides like that, but I couldn't read out a killing sequence (though S3 feels like a good place to try). Not that it means there isn't one. But they have to make sure we're 100% sealed in first, right?
I have a couple teammates who haven't suggested moves yet - if they think we're in danger of dying, I'm sure one of them will suggest a move to save our bacon. Although if it weren't a team game, I guess I would have to play S4.
Re: Teamovitch #1
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 2:54 pm
by Joaz Banbeck
Black internal chat:
fwiffo wrote:... But they have to make sure we're 100% sealed in first, right?
Yes, and someone on our team has to make sure that they can't. It can't be me, for even if I see a sequence to live, I can't play it unless you folks nominate the moves for me.
I like your move. I really want to play it, for it is the last big corner play on the board. But I have to know that we don't die big in the middle because of it.
To observers:
I have not analyzed exhaustively, but so far, I think that we live. However, one of my teammates has to tell me that he knows that we live. I can't do it myself.
Re: Teamovitch #1
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:48 pm
by Jordus
Black internal chat
if we are really worried about that group and want to play for eyes then our choices are Joaz:s as formentioned a and b miai... my first instinct is to play c or d after thinking about it I kind of like e...
$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . . , . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O O . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , X a . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . d . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O b c e . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . . , . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O O . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , X a . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . d . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O b c e . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
The more I look at it, it seems kinda crazy that we'd be unconditionally alive in such a small space with two open skirts, so I don't trust my reading. I think a is probably the best way to live so that's my new suggestion. If one of my teammates think I was right the first time, they can resuggest my previous move.
Re: Teamovitch #1
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 8:37 pm
by Jedo
black suggestion
Ugh, I hate it, but according to my reading we're not alive unconditionally.
$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . . , . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O O . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , X a . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . d . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O b c e . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm41 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . O X X . . . , . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . O X . O O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X . . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . O X . O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . X . . O . X O . O O . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . X . , X a . | $$ | . . . . X . . . . X . O X . . X . d . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O b c e . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I'm going to suggest b though, because if a the placement of e is very painful. Of course we could always play in the upper right, let white reduce us to one eye in gote, and then somehow muddle through with our sente.
below is sente:
right now, so trying to use the aji right now seems premature. My suggestion feels big, taking fourth line territory. It also relates to the ladder in the middle, so may be helpful if we decide to rescue the cutting stone 
.
