Life In 19x19

Slightly unexpected, but easy to answer (pretty much the only move I can think of). Lets see how this develops.

This move is obvious, the real thinking comes with my next move. Still haven't decided which to take (ie, which side has a more damaging followup move for me if tj ignores.)

Let's see if he cuts or not

Iirc, m16 and n16 are the two joseki options. Normally when you connect in a joseki with this basic pattern (attach, hane, extend, connect), the reason is because either the cut or the peep is severe. Here it's the cut that looks bad to me. I'm sure tj has read it out and thinks he can do something good, but anything other than the cut for me would be ultra-submissive.

I must confess that I don't like this at all. I tried different variations including starting with the atari at N17 or M16, but I liked them even less than this. I suspect he will continue to push, and I will have to descend at least once more. What will happen after that I will read in more detail later. The worst case is I will die a horrible death, but I don't like getting a small life closed in either. We'll see.

Perhaps I should just sacrifice that stone, but it the resulting corner would be just too huge.

If you don't like any of the results after he cut, why did you leave the cutting point? Didn't you ask yourself what you'd do if he cut?

I think that this fight can't be bad for black.

I should have read earlier.

i dont think it is that easy for black either.
i actually think white's move is strong and can be played.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm29 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 4 3 7 5 . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . 8 . 2 1 . . 9 . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . , . . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O . . . . . . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

If I don't get something cool out of this situation, that only proves that I suck at go. I'd kill to know whether he wants to win this fight, or it's just an "add one, sacrifice both" situation. I guess I'll find out very soon... But honestly, I have no idea what his next move is.

I tried to do some reading, but I probably missed something important. Anyway, this is my first instinct, and I didn't find any huge problems with it. It should create some kind of base for the O17-group, and possibly also help to harass the M16 group.

The opposite direction is one option, but black will close the side and I will still have to fight hard to live in the corner.

BTW, I think that B30 was a mistake, and it should have been @N17.

I keep going back and forth between this and some move that protects the corner. The problem is, I can't find a move that protects the corner in sente. Eventually I decided that playing Q18 in sente is W's right here, and if we change the move order a bit a lot of w's moves look funky. Right?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm Prisoner Count: B-0 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . X . . O . . 2 . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . , . 8 6 7 . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 4 0 . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O . . . . . . . 9 . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Seems natural. I'm thinking:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm31 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . 3 O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . 4 X . . O . 5 . . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . , . X X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O . . . . . . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

which should secure life.

Weird. That has to be premature, right? He's pushing from behind on the second line.

I'm thinking about this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm31 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . 5 4 . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . 6 X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . , . X X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O . . . . . . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Later he can capture P18 to secure his group, but I then get the corner in sente.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm31 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O . 7 4 . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . 8 5 X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . 6 . X X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O . . . . . . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

No sense in playing the hane if he's going to come back and defend, right?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm31 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O O 8 9 4 . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . 7 5 X . 0 O . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . 6 . X X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O . . . . . . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

The question is how good of a threat p18 is. If this is the result, it looks pretty good to me... but there may be a better followup than . If he connects at N19 to cut me (which is a must, I think), I have sente. I start attacking N15; he tries to save himself by threatening N16; strengthening that group threatens K17; and then I have sente to start threatening N15 again. If I can start or finish with R8, I'm golden.

But I want to look at two things. Thing one is how it looks if W double hanes for . Thing two is where we stand if I passively extend. Like I said, third line influence is still pretty good in this game, and my strategic interests are (i) protecting my position in the upper left, (ii) getting R8, (iii) getting strong to attack N15. Taking the full corner instead of sharing it is only (iv).