102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

User avatar
Loons
Gosei
Posts: 1378
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:17 am
GD Posts: 0
Location: wHam!lton, Aotearoa
Has thanked: 253 times
Been thanked: 105 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Loons »

I think black's resistances make this a fun tsumego.
Revisiting Go - Study Journal
My Programming Blog - About the evolution of my go bot.
User avatar
Magicwand
Tengen
Posts: 4844
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:26 am
Rank: Wbaduk 7D
GD Posts: 0
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 504 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Magicwand »

for obs only:
:b1: is my first instinct..does it work?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 1 O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
User avatar
gaius
Lives in gote
Posts: 476
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 2:55 am
Rank: Dutch 2 dan
GD Posts: 56
KGS: hopjesvla
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 83 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by gaius »

@Magicwand:
It looks kind of nice to break the ladder, but... What's the plan here?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . 2 . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 1 O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
My name is Gijs, from Utrecht, NL.

When in doubt, play the most aggressive move
User avatar
Magicwand
Tengen
Posts: 4844
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:26 am
Rank: Wbaduk 7D
GD Posts: 0
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 504 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Magicwand »

gaius wrote:@Magicwand:
It looks kind of nice to break the ladder, but... What's the plan here?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . 2 . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 1 O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

it breaks ladder and also same time it breaks the net.
didnt really read deep but something close to below variation..
below variation is bad for white.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 9 |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X 7 4 . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . 2 . X 6 . 8 |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 1 O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
User avatar
Shaddy
Lives in sente
Posts: 1206
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 2:44 pm
Rank: KGS 5d
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Str1fe, Midorisuke
Has thanked: 51 times
Been thanked: 192 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Shaddy »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm39 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Agonised between this and the table shape. I chose this in the end because it takes a liberty from white, which will be valuable later.. I also considered hitting the two stones on the nose, but white gets a good result if he answers correctly, according to my reading.
User avatar
Chew Terr
Gosei
Posts: 2060
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:45 pm
Rank: KGS 3k
GD Posts: 264
KGS: Chew
Location: Texas
Has thanked: 546 times
Been thanked: 172 times
Contact:

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Chew Terr »

Shaddy wrote:
Agonised between this and the table shape. I chose this in the end because it takes a liberty from white, which will be valuable later.. I also considered hitting the two stones on the nose, but white gets a good result if he answers correctly, according to my reading.


Shaddy:
Mind sharing your reading of the correct response?
Someday I want to be strong enough to earn KGS[-].
User avatar
Shaddy
Lives in sente
Posts: 1206
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 2:44 pm
Rank: KGS 5d
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Str1fe, Midorisuke
Has thanked: 51 times
Been thanked: 192 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Shaddy »

Chew Terr wrote:
Shaddy wrote:
Agonised between this and the table shape. I chose this in the end because it takes a liberty from white, which will be valuable later.. I also considered hitting the two stones on the nose, but white gets a good result if he answers correctly, according to my reading.


Shaddy:
Mind sharing your reading of the correct response?

For all:
Looks like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . 4 . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . 2 . 3 X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 1 O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


And black has problems..
User avatar
Chew Terr
Gosei
Posts: 2060
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:45 pm
Rank: KGS 3k
GD Posts: 264
KGS: Chew
Location: Texas
Has thanked: 546 times
Been thanked: 172 times
Contact:

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Chew Terr »

Thanks, I think I was missing 4.
Someday I want to be strong enough to earn KGS[-].
cloud
Dies in gote
Posts: 64
Joined: Sun May 02, 2010 9:58 pm
Rank: AGA 4D
GD Posts: 15
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by cloud »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm49 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X 1 |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Good timing for this hane in my opinion. Black will almost certainly answer, and it helps secure the life of the corner group. This fight is interesting to me.
User avatar
Shaddy
Lives in sente
Posts: 1206
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 2:44 pm
Rank: KGS 5d
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Str1fe, Midorisuke
Has thanked: 51 times
Been thanked: 192 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Shaddy »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm50 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
cloud
Dies in gote
Posts: 64
Joined: Sun May 02, 2010 9:58 pm
Rank: AGA 4D
GD Posts: 15
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by cloud »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm50 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . 2 . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Time to live in the corner.
User avatar
Shaddy
Lives in sente
Posts: 1206
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 2:44 pm
Rank: KGS 5d
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Str1fe, Midorisuke
Has thanked: 51 times
Been thanked: 192 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Shaddy »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm50 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . 2 . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Get your sente while it's hot!
cloud
Dies in gote
Posts: 64
Joined: Sun May 02, 2010 9:58 pm
Rank: AGA 4D
GD Posts: 15
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by cloud »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm50 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X 4 2 . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

This is a better way to live then simply pulling back because it leaves some bad aji around O17
User avatar
Shaddy
Lives in sente
Posts: 1206
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 2:44 pm
Rank: KGS 5d
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Str1fe, Midorisuke
Has thanked: 51 times
Been thanked: 192 times

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Shaddy »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm50 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 3 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X 4 2 . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X 5 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X O |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . O , O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O , X . . . X , X . . |
$$ | . . X O O X . . . O X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
User avatar
Laman
Lives in gote
Posts: 655
Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:24 pm
Rank: 1d KGS
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Laman
Location: Czechia
Has thanked: 29 times
Been thanked: 41 times
Contact:

Re: 102. Shaddy (3d?) vs. cloud (3d)

Post by Laman »

the game is really exciting so far and it is nice to watch two dan players playing, but would mind separating your actual move(s) from previous move(s) of your opponent? i don't know about other spectators but it is a bit confusing for me to check every diagram with the previous one to see which moves are really new. hopefully it wouldn't add much work for you

if you have some special reason for that way of making diagrams or if others like it this way, then feel free to skip my post and sorry for disturbing
Spilling gasoline feels good.

I might be wrong, but probably not.
Post Reply