[go]$$Wcm68 $$ +---------------------------------------+ $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X 2 . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . 4 . . . X X X O O 3 . | $$ | . . . , . . 1 . . , . X C X O X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X . X O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X . X O . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . O O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X X . . . . O X . . . . . . O X . . | $$ | . X O O . X O . X . . . . . X X O O . | $$ | . O . . . . O X . . . . . X X O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . O X O , . . . X O O O . . | $$ | . . . . . X X . . . X . X O X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
Re: #241 : xoxo88 vs Loons
Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 5:43 pm
by Uberdude
White is dreaming if he thinks black should play 71. Coming into the top left is much bigger. Probably white should have secured that.
Re: #241 : xoxo88 vs Loons
Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 9:47 pm
by Loons
I assume Uberdude is pointing out that black would prefer eg. C17 to -1, 7. Noted.
My estimate puts black at about 51 points and white around forty on the board, though a lot of what I count for white is slightly imaginary. So I feel about five points down, maybe ten.
Re: #241 : xoxo88 vs Loons
Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 11:44 pm
by xoxo88
$$Bcm69 $$ +---------------------------------------+ $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . , . . O . . , . X . X O X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X . X O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . 1 O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X . X O . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . O O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X X . . . . O X . . . . . . O X . . | $$ | . X O O . X O . X . . . . . X X O O . | $$ | . O . . . . O X . . . . . X X O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . O X O , . . . X O O O . . | $$ | . . . . . X X . . . X . X O X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ +---------------------------------------+
[go]$$Bcm69 $$ +---------------------------------------+ $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . , . . O . . , . X . X O X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X . X O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . 1 O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X . X O . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . O O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X X . . . . O X . . . . . . O X . . | $$ | . X O O . X O . X . . . . . X X O O . | $$ | . O . . . . O X . . . . . X X O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . O X O , . . . X O O O . . | $$ | . . . . . X X . . . X . X O X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
im wondering what happens here... as far i count i win the capturing race so white should give me the corner and have to live then. i will think about this a littlebit and let it open for now. the thing is, even if it works it might be gote and gives white the opportunity to play the huge B12. and i dont think he will play r18 himself in the near future. im pretty sure he knows that im ahead by a small amount so i estimate these kind of multipurpose moves like 68. if i still think it works after the left corner fighting ill come back.
$$Bcm69 $$ +---------------------------------------+ $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 X 4 . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O 2 . | $$ | . . . , . . O . . , . X . X O X 1 3 . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X . X O O . . 7 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . O 5 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 6 . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X . X O . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . O O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X X . . . . O X . . . . . . O X . . | $$ | . X O O . X O . X . . . . . X X O O . | $$ | . O . . . . O X . . . . . X X O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . O X O , . . . X O O O . . | $$ | . . . . . X X . . . X . X O X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ +---------------------------------------+
[go]$$Bcm69 $$ +---------------------------------------+ $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 X 4 . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O 2 . | $$ | . . . , . . O . . , . X . X O X 1 3 . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X . X O O . . 7 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . O 5 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 6 . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X . X O . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . O O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X X . . . . O X . . . . . . O X . . | $$ | . X O O . X O . X . . . . . X X O O . | $$ | . O . . . . O X . . . . . X X O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . O X O , . . . X O O O . . | $$ | . . . . . X X . . . X . X O X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
Re: #241 : xoxo88 vs Loons
Posted: Sat Aug 23, 2014 12:32 am
by xoxo88
hmm i wonder if it wouldnt have been better to invade right away. now w may play c16 himself. i noticed that the trade b12, e8 helps me to invade his middle moyo :/ so many questions on this board. i guess if w plays defensive c16 now ill fight out the north east corner and see what happens to make some questionmarks go away.
$$Bcm69 $$ +---------------------------------------+ $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . 1 . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . , . . O . . , . X . X O X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X . X O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . 2 O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X . X O . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . 3 . . O O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X X . . . . O X . . . . . . O X . . | $$ | . X O O . X O . X . . . . . X X O O . | $$ | . O . . . . O X . . . . . X X O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . O X O , . . . X O O O . . | $$ | . . . . . X X . . . X . X O X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ +---------------------------------------+
[go]$$Bcm69 $$ +---------------------------------------+ $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . 1 . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . , . . O . . , . X . X O X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X . X O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . 2 O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X . X O . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . 3 . . O O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X X . . . . O X . . . . . . O X . . | $$ | . X O O . X O . X . . . . . X X O O . | $$ | . O . . . . O X . . . . . X X O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . O X O , . . . X O O O . . | $$ | . . . . . X X . . . X . X O X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
Re: #241 : xoxo88 vs Loons
Posted: Sat Aug 23, 2014 12:50 am
by Loons
I wasn't expecting this. My first instinct is weird. Well, not weird considering I was thinking of the 3-3 invasion for black. My stones on the left still cover the centre a bit.
$$Bm69 $$ +---------------------------------------+ $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . 2 , . . O . . , . X . X O X . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X . X O O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . 1 O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X . X O . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . O O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . X X . . . . O X . . . . . . O X . . | $$ | . X O O . X O . X . . . . . X X O O . | $$ | . O . . . . O X . . . . . X X O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . O X O , . . . X O O O . . | $$ | . . . . . X X . . . X . X O X . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ +---------------------------------------+
the ladder (a), how about 
? Seems double sente ( 
) ?
also seems over-concentrated for B ?
