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#204 Annihilist vs Otenki

https://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?t=7710

Page 6 of 7

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:16 am
by otenki
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 4 . . 2 . 3 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



Now that I look at the situation again, I realy must make my corner stone work.
I will do this by creating a wall in the center. My 32 stone will be used as aji instead to build the wall which has 2 or at least 1 eye in the corner.

So what does 34 do ? It is a move that invites black to hane.
If black hanes then I can use a bunch of forcing moves to make a wall to attack left side and to live in the corner.

Black can decide to push me into the corner and let me live bigger but I think he will negate the value of influence.
He will probably think its worth nothing. But if I can build influence and chase the left group then I will have control over the center in no time.

This is a difficult plan but if I succeed I think I can control this game more.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 5:07 pm
by Uberdude
@otenki
otenki wrote:So what does 34 do ? It is a move that invites black to hane.


It invites black to hane and cut your groups apart. That is why 32 is not joseki: it does not threaten to connect under with this attachment. One space low pincer is joseki because then your 34 would connect. Connecting is good, getting cut is bad, basics.

otenki wrote:If black hanes then I can use a bunch of forcing moves to make a wall to attack left side and to live in the corner.

Black can decide to push me into the corner and let me live bigger but I think he will negate the value of influence.
He will probably think its worth nothing. But if I can build influence and chase the left group then I will have control over the center in no time.

This is a difficult plan but if I succeed I think I can control this game more.


I have no idea what you are talking about! Basics first. Connecting good, getting cut bad.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 3:55 am
by otenki
@Uberdude

I see what you mean but I was afraid of playing one space low pincer because area on the right becomes too big if he jumps.
My idea was that I could fight on middle left by building thickness of the aji stone 32.
But I guess one space pincer => living in the corner + reducing the right side area is a better/safer plan.

Thank you for helping me see my basic mistakes.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:20 pm
by Annihilist
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 4 5 . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I was hesitant about this because I wasn't sure about the cross cut.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 6 O 1 . O . B . . a . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X 2 4 . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I can extend from the cross cut and then monkey jump to connect to my stones on the right.

It makes sense for W to attack at a or somewhere nearby, so I'm expecting that after this progression. This, of course, is assuming he cuts. If he backs down, that's even better.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:16 am
by otenki
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 4 5 . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Making some kind of shape in order to execute previous stated plan.
It threatens to connect or cut. (miai)

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 1:43 am
by Annihilist
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X 7 . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Solid connection with the intent of splitting his groups, also leaving him with a weak stone on the right.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:18 am
by otenki
I'm still fully enjoying this game, how about you ? Tell me if and when it should start to become boring.

Cheers,
Otenki

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X 7 . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



Feels kind of slow but I want to keep connected in order to attack with a decent group or invade the right side later.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:58 am
by Amelia
Otenki (Beginner's question)

How do you feel about your initial plan? Is it working the way you hoped it would and why?

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 5:36 pm
by Annihilist
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X X . 9 . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Lets keep him sealed in. I assumed he'd play one line up (first line) to keep him connected.

Edit: Just noticed a weakness in his shape:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm1 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 5 O 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O 4 X X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


And if he plays this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm1 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 4 O 1 O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 3 O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O 6 X X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Either capturing race, or connect and die. At least, that's how it looks.

Couple of whole board points I should play at some point:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , X X . 9 . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . c . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . a . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . d . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . b . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . e . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


a: Been through this before. I really want to play it, and I think if he does he can make big gains
b: This is good after one of us plays a. If he does, I can sneak under and reduce his territory. I'd say a and b are almost miai - almost, not quite.
c: not sure if this is good or not. Need to read into it more.
d: Same, but this looks more promising. It limits development of his group.
e: Going off a limb here, but I wonder if I can save this group. Evidently failed invasion, and I know what my mistake was, but I'm not giving up yet.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:20 am
by otenki
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm31 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O 0 X X . 9 . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Fix shape and get ready to fight. :rambo:


@Amelia: I'll answer your question later.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 6:00 pm
by Annihilist
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I wanted to do this for a while.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:24 am
by otenki
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Amelia, I'll try to answer your question now also:

Black is playing quite well for a 10kyu kgs. Of course since this is a game in which both of us have lots of time to read the
difference in reading strength is not visible. Nevertheless black is doing great.

Howhever lets talk about positional judgment. What do you percieve this board like ?
My first responce is to be VERY afraid of being white on this board.
Black seems to have a huge moyo which can turn into a lot of points.

Howhever now that I look more objective I see that his moyo has lots of problems.
I'll get to them as I describe my next move.

Now lets look at white. White has a small moyo as well and some power on the lower right.
White's moyo is also full of problems. Because of the aji of the not so dead stones in the lower left black has lots of ways to reduce this allready small moyo of white.

That sucks :-)

So what can we do ?

- Fix own problems (big, no more reduction from black)
- Attack blacks weaknesses. (very big but very hard to do if you have my reading skills :-) )
- Create aji that will allow us to invade/reduce blacks moyo later. (very big but really needs to be sente so a bit risky)

So I'll try to attack blacks weaknesses and invade this way.

Maybe I can lean on the left side to attack the top:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O 7 X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X 6 , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 8 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 4 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X 3 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Howhever the left side becomes soooo strong which is bad for my own moyo.
If black now starts attacking my left side, the game will be very hard.

How about the other way around ?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O 5 X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X 4 , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 3 . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 8 . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This might work but I'm not sure he will play this way.
Maybe he will just push instead:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O 5 X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X 4 , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 3 . . 8 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 7 . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . 9 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


2 feels a bit wrong though, lets try a bit further...
Its too close to black and too many stronger players have told me not to do this.
I usualy also play with better results if I don't so I won't.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O 7 X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X 6 , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 4 . 0 . 8 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 . 2 . 9 . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



Now a complex fight starts. I haven't read out what could happen in all the scenarios but I think I like this.
I realize this is a dangerous move because it can be cut, however I think there is plenty of aji for doing something there.

I'll play 2 and see what happens.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:31 pm
by Annihilist
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I expected this kind of move. So I'm going to threaten to break into his corner.

I also considered this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm41 Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X X . X . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 4 2 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X X O X . . . . . . . . O O X X . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Or something similar, not sure how accurate my reading is here. But I can play this move next.

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:33 pm
by Uberdude
@Annihilist

Annihilist wrote: But I can play this move next.


Are you forgetting that in Go the players take turns, so unless white passes he may play a move which means you can't do that move next? ;-)

Re: #204 Annihilist vs Otenki

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:40 pm
by Annihilist
Uberdude wrote:@Annihilist

Annihilist wrote: But I can play this move next.


Are you forgetting that in Go the players take turns, so unless white passes he may play a move which means you can't do that move next? ;-)

Uberdude (+obs)
No. I expect him to descend, to stop me from destroying his corner. Which leaves the same move vacant for me. Of course, he could play that connecting move if he wants. But that leaves him with inefficient shape, and his corner is still open.

One thing I forgot to mention is my move also serves to secure more territory along the left side.
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