Yes, but I don't think I should publish them on a family forum.
Re: New Move
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 3:04 pm
by MJK
http://www.go4go.net/go/games/sgfview/41563
The variation which appeared in the game viewable via the link above seems to be better for white according to some professionals.
It looks pretty stup- [see the link to pro game] -endous, perhaps a new joseki in the making.
Re: New Move
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 5:52 pm
by Uberdude
It's an extravagant move, I believe Joanne Missingham was the first to play it a couple of years ago. The proverb "When in doubt, tenuki" is handy. It is on the 2nd line after all.
Re: New Move
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 5:53 pm
by moyoaji
I don't like black's reply in the game. Is there a reason black had to back off and couldn't play like this?
Uberdude wrote:It's an extravagant move, I believe Joanne Missingham was the first to play it a couple of years ago. The proverb "When in doubt, tenuki" is handy. It is on the 2nd line after all.
There is also a proverb that says you should always respond to an attachment.
If white gets moves around 3 in sente 5 works a lot better and you can munch yourself a chunky corner. (in some variations you can hane at 2-2 and tombstone squeeze).
P.S. I'm not saying tenuki is best, but if someone plays this move against you in a quick game and you want some guidance how to do ok then thinking of that proverb and playing tenuki and aiming for a trade where you get the corner and they get the pincer stone is an easy way to not epic fail.
P.P.S. There's some similarity with this other strange 2nd line attachment that's also tricky (but not necessarily a bad trick in that you can do ok if they answer correctly, Su Yang 6d says he's not sure of the best answer); 4, whilst locally breaking white's shape, is falling for the bait and giving white a big corner for not enough in return. 4 as hane at 6 and take the ponnuki is probably best.
moyoaji wrote:
There is also a proverb that says you should always respond to an attachment.
Black didn't respond to white's attach at 3-3
Re: New Move
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:04 pm
by Uberdude
Joanne Missingham (Hei Jiajia) using it in 2010, the first time I saw it.
Re: New Move
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:05 pm
by Fedya
Any thoughts?
What was wrong with the old moves?
Re: New Move
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:27 pm
by Uberdude
Fedya wrote:
Any thoughts?
What was wrong with the old moves?
Boring.
More seriously, in JM's game I think this standard joseki may be globally good for black (and some may even say locally). I usually like that corner though...
Also black can choose to play 4 at 5 and then if white pincers r7 at r9 black can stubbornly cut and fight with the iron pillar at a.
Re: New Move
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:57 pm
by moyoaji
Uberdude wrote:If white gets moves around 3 in sente 5 works a lot better and you can munch yourself a chunky corner. (in some variations you can hane at 2-2 and tombstone squeeze).
Interesting. I had not considered this move.
Uberdude wrote:Black didn't respond to white's attach at 3-3
Yes black didn't hane or extend, but black did respond. He made a two space extension to help his stone. Black's move was not a tenuki - it was a local response.
Re: New Move
Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:17 am
by DrStraw
Uberdude wrote:Joanne Missingham (Hei Jiajia) using it in 2010, the first time I saw it.
Wow! If I had seen that game in isolation I think I may have thought it was a couple of weak amateurs! It's all over the place.
