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Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Sat Jan 10, 2015 12:11 pm
by Nathanl
I've been playing go off and on for years and never really got any better. I played a fair amount at times and still hovered around 17-16k. I watched some Sibicky youtube videos and read Opening Theory Made Easy and I progressed to about 14-13k in a week.
This lit a fire under me when I realized I was doing it wrong.
My plan is:
Keep about 4-6 correspondence games going at a time on OGS (now if only I could get people to stop joining the games then immediately canceling them..) I find with the correspondence games I can really think about what is the "biggest move" and don't get pulled into fights as much. Not to say fighting skills aren't necessary but there's other parts of my game that need more work.
Speaking of avoiding fights, I'm stopping small board play altogether. Instead I will look at tsumego or other
books instead when I have a few minutes to spare instead of playing the small boards. I don't think they help me progress at all.
Continuing the Sibicky videos here and there. Unfortunately I don't often have an hour to spare but when I can they seem good. Perhaps commented go games would give some of the same benefit but in a package more friendly on time constraints.
Last but not least, I think I'm only going to play live games only the weekends to try to put to use what I learn.
Seems weird to say I'm going to get better by playing less but I think at my current level I think self learning from live games isn't the way to go.
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Sat Jan 10, 2015 1:29 pm
by tentano
Just don't stop any type of play because of "progress". You shouldn't keep yourself from enjoying the game. Progress can be important, sure, but if you can't have fun anymore you'll burn out or get bored.
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 2:33 am
by joellercoaster
I've stopped playing small board games recently for a similar reason!
My biggest deficiencies at the moment are definitely tactical - shape, liberties, fighting. And playing small board games is
fun and scratches a particular itch... it's the same itch that doing tsumego scratches. But the tsumego are definitely more nutritious! If I play 9x9 games I don't have the hunger any more, and tsumego come to a halt.
So for the moment, 9x9 and 13x13 are on the shelf (not forever, just for the moment).
I am losing nearly all my 19x19 games in the meantime but it's character-building

Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 7:45 am
by Bill Spight
joellercoaster wrote:I've stopped playing small board games recently for a similar reason!
My biggest deficiencies at the moment are definitely tactical - shape, liberties, fighting. And playing small board games is fun and scratches a particular itch... it's the same itch that doing tsumego scratches. But the tsumego are definitely more nutritious! If I play 9x9 games I don't have the hunger any more, and tsumego come to a halt.
Who are you playing your 9x9 games against? If they are your own strength, then you are probably right, that tsumego is better for your progress. But if you have to take two stones on the 9x9, that's another thing.

Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2015 3:43 am
by Dragonfist
Playing is the most important part for improving imo, especially at your level. Also, players your level usually have basic shape trouble, so read shape up, it's a free book online. Studying basic joseki is also important, they teach you about shape.
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2015 3:52 pm
by often
if you want to improve, play is important
that said
correspondence games will not help you that much.
play some games on a live go server instead.
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 6:24 am
by Knotwilg
1. Play (60%)
2. Review your games (20%)
3. Do tsumego (15%)
4. Read something (5%)
5. Apply it in your games
6. Review your games
7. etc
What kind of games? FTF or online games that allow you to think but within a time constraint. No time or unlimited time won't foster progress.
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 6:49 am
by Nathanl
Thanks for the tips! I got Shape Up and have been reading it on the bus etc. I guess I've been skipping the review your games part. On another plus I got some people together to play locally including a 4k player who is happy to teach. Having someone in person to give advice is pretty nice.
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 8:16 am
by RobertJasiek
Nathanl wrote:I played a fair amount at times and still hovered around 17-16k.
This means that the balance between play and study is not your problem. Your problem is missing some essential input. You can solve this by these means:
1) Take such a teacher that identifies, explains and corrects your major mistakes.
2) Attend a club in which people do (1).
3) Read all the essential books for your level.
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 8:30 am
by Nathanl
I liked this game. I thought it was going well. I took a few groups, felt I was doing well, then lost a large group at the end and lost by a point and a half. Looking back I had a few lucky breaks, white defended some groups that had little chance of living that gave me some free moves (the groups at g2 and j8). I felt like a fool when white played T5 and I realized I let him back in the game.
I also tried hard to come up with a few end game points, found a couple but not enough.
Any thoughts on what I could have done better would be appreciated.
http://www.lifein19x19.com/forum/download/file.php?id=5539
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:19 am
by skydyr
Some comments:
http://lifein19x19.com/forum/download/file.php?id=5540
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:08 am
by Knotwilg
If I may isolate the major points according to me:
47-49 Very bad technique. See "Small Gaps" at Sensei's library
93 saving dead stones may end up in more dead stones
115 saving a group requires solid expansions of eyespace, not endgame jumps
206 a beautiful tesuji reverses the game
It's weird that White, before executing a high level move like 206, plays as if he's not reading, just throwing stones onto the board, on several occasions. This doesn't make your case, but it makes it a hard game to comment on. In several parts of the board, he lost big strings of stones by playing impossible moves.
Both have a commonly observed tendency to "play where the opponent just played". In some cases that makes one play a move that was possible right before the opponent went there.
There is definitely room for improvement in basic technique. See Sensei's Library articles "Haengma Tutorial for Beginners", "L'ame du Go", "Small Gaps" and "Basic Instinct".
Enjoy!
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2015 7:50 am
by Nathanl
Despite my original post I've played a lot compared to my reading. That and watching much higher ranked games, usually without commentary. Got up to 13/12k on OGS and 10k on KGS (should break that SDK barrier with another win!) I feel like I've been doing better with basic shape and a lot better with keeping sente. However, when I lose though I lose big. It's rare I lose by a few points, I go out with a bang. I win by komi often though. Not sure what that says. Maybe it means I still have shape problems that are getting exploited? I plan to review this game. I feel like I cost myself this game in several ways. I couldn't sleep thinking about it after.
http://www.lifein19x19.com/forum/download/file.php?id=5654
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2015 8:19 am
by skydyr
A review:
http://lifein19x19.com/forum/download/file.php?id=5655
Re: Finding the balance between play and study
Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2015 10:48 am
by Bill Spight
A few comments.
(;FF[4]ST[2]CA[ISO8859-1]GM[1]AP[GOWrite:2.3.46]SZ[19]PB[nathanl]FG[259:]BR[14k]WR[12k]HA[2]PM[2]KM[0.5]RU[japanese]CP[online-go.com]RE[W+R]GN[ ]DT[2015-02-19]PC[OGS\: http\://online-go.com/game/1566855]PW[theo61]AB[dp][pd]
;W[pp]
;B[cd]
;W[ed]
;B[df]
;W[cc]
;B[dd]C[*** Not good unless Black plans to cut.]
;W[dc]
(
;B[ee]C[*** Black is overconcentrated. See variation.]
;W[bd]C[*** Not good.]
(
;B[ec]C[*** Good fighting spirit. But this does not work. Chalk one up to experience. See variation.]
;W[fd]
;B[ce]C[*** Very bad shape. Five stones to surround one point? See variation for next.]
(
;W[gd]
;B[jc]
;W[hc]
;B[mc]
;W[qc]
;B[pc]
;W[qd]
;B[qe]
;W[re]
;B[qf]
;W[rf]
;B[qg]
;W[pb]
;B[ob]
;W[qb]
(
;B[oc]C[*** See how overcrowded Black is? Black should at least play elsewhere now. See variation.]
;W[ke]
;B[me]C[*** Black gets ever more overconcentrated.]
;W[jd]
;B[kc]
;W[id]
;B[qn]
;W[qp]
;B[on]C[*** Good! There are other good plays, as well.]
;W[rh]
(
;B[dj]C[*** See variation.
End of comments.]
;W[iq]
;B[mq]
;W[oq]
;B[nr]
;W[fq]
;B[cn]
;W[np]
;B[jr]
;W[dr]
;B[cq]
;W[ir]
;B[jq]
;W[or]
;B[rg]
;W[sg]
;B[qh]
;W[ri]
;B[qi]
;W[mo]
;B[mp]
;W[nn]
;B[rj]
;W[om]
;B[ok]
;W[pl]
;B[rl]
;W[pk]
;B[oi]
;W[dl]
;B[cl]
;W[ck]
;B[bl]
;W[dk]
;B[cj]
;W[bk]
;B[bj]
;W[ej]
;B[pn]
;W[nl]
;B[be]
;W[ac]
;B[cr]
;W[er]
;B[gf]
;W[ei]
;B[jp]
;W[ip]
;B[jo]
;W[cm]
;B[bm]
;W[dn]
;B[do]
;W[dm]
;B[io]
;W[ho]
;B[fo]
;W[gp]
;B[il]
;W[fn]
;B[eo]
;W[gn]
;B[ak]
;W[bn]
;B[bo]
;W[co]
;B[an]
;W[cn]
;B[bp]
;W[mg]
;B[lf]
;W[lh]
;B[lg]
;W[mi]
;B[mj]
;W[lj]
;B[mk]
;W[ji]
;B[jg]
;W[hi]
;B[lm]
;W[gl]
;B[di]
;W[eh]
;B[lo]
;W[nf]
;B[kd]
;W[dh]
;B[ch]
;W[ro]
;B[rn]
;W[hk]
;B[je]
;W[ie]
;B[jf]
;W[ne]
;B[mf]
;W[nh]
;B[og]
;W[ng]
;B[ib]
;W[hb]
;B[ha]
;W[gb]
;B[os]
;W[pr]
;B[ps]
;W[qs]
;B[ns]
;W[qr]
;B[ga]
;W[fa]
;B[ia]
;W[fb]
;B[kk]
;W[kj]
;B[gh]
;W[gi]
;B[fg]
;W[ic]
;B[jb]
;W[nq]
;B[mr]
;W[nd]
;B[mn]
;W[no]
;B[ol]
;W[nk]
;B[oj]
;W[pm]
;B[mm]
;W[nm]
;B[ae]
;W[rd]
;B[is]
;W[hs]
;B[js]
;W[in]
;B[jn]
;W[im]
;B[jm]
;W[hl]
;B[hr]
;W[gs]
;B[gr]
;W[fs]
;B[fr]
;W[es]
;B[eq]
;W[gq]
;B[dq]
;W[hq]
;B[en]
;W[em]
;B[sf]
;W[sh]
;B[se]
;W[sd]
;B[sf]
;W[se]
;B[sb]
;W[rb]
;B[pa]
;W[sc]
;B[ra]
;W[qa]
;B[oa]
;W[sa]
;B[ik]
;W[ij]
;B[ih]
;W[ii]
;B[hh]
;W[qj]C[nathanl\: Fighting the inevitable, good game
theo61\: thanks for the game
theo61\: good game i shall have a review for me.... because there are many fights
theo61\: see you it is late in germany]
)
(
;B[np]C[*** Big. This threat is part of what makes the previous Black jump big.]
)
)
(
;
;B[tt]C[*** Just a pass to show how to handle the White cut.]
;W[oc]
;B[od]
;W[nc]
(
;B[nb]C[*** If the ladder works.]
)
(
;B[nd]C[*** If the ladder does not work.]
;W[nb]
;B[mb]
;W[oa]C[*** See how small the White threat is?]
)
)
)
(
;W[be]
;B[bf]
;W[cg]
;B[cf]
)
)
(
;B[fd]C[*** This is big.]
;W[ec]
;B[be]
;W[bc]
;B[fe]C[*** Big.]
)
)
(
;B[ec]C[*** This cut is consistent, but . . .]
;W[fc]
;B[eb]
;W[fb]
;B[ee]
;W[fd]
;B[bc]
;W[db]
;B[cb]
;W[ea]C[*** The result is not so good. But it is better than the game.]
)
)
Main focus: Avoid overconcentration.