Life In 19x19

Hi

In Chess, there's a Dutch series called the "Steps Method", which has been translated to many different languages. After following these books, a complete beginner in Chess will end up at playing between 2000 and 2100 ELO after step 6. (Regrettably, this series wasn't yet around at the time I learned to play Chess. Now that I think of it, I've never reached 2100 ELO. Maybe, at some point, I should read the later books in this series.)

In Go, I have only found one similar series: Level Up (30k-10k, 10 books), and Jump Level Up (10k-1k), published by BadukTopia. I see that these series get good to very good reviews.

Are there any other similar series available for Go?

I think these qualify - I am using them with my kids now:

http://senseis.xmp.net/?GradedGoProblemsForBeginners

Babelardus wrote:these series get good to very good reviews.

Presumably the books are attractive for some, from whom you might see reviews. They are unattractive for others. I found them so contents-light that I saw no point in browsing through them for more than a few seconds, let alone reviewing them. Consider buying them if you like learning in "comic" style - otherwise disregard them. Frankly, they are cheap enough, so why not get some book and judge by yourself if it meets your preference?

RobertJasiek wrote:

Babelardus wrote:these series get good to very good reviews.

Presumably the books are attractive for some, from whom you might see reviews. They are unattractive for others. I found them so contents-light that I saw no point in browsing through them for more than a few seconds, let alone reviewing them. Consider buying them if you like learning in "comic" style - otherwise disregard them. Frankly, they are cheap enough, so why not get some book and judge by yourself if it meets your preference?

Thanks for your feedback. The one thing I need in a book is that it tells my *WHY* something is good or bad. Even if a book describes many subjects and concepts, only telling someone "this is good, that is bad" is not good enough; that leads to people playing 'good' things without understanding why they (should) work. In this case, it will be almost impossible to use the technique or concept successfully.

Right now, I'm bouncing around between 5k and 10k or so, sometimes winning an even game against a 5k, and then losing a game against a 10k. Sometimes 'good' things don't work for me, while 'bad' things do work for the opponent. I think that this is caused by a lack of understanding of the techniques and concepts I'm trying to use.

Do you know of any books that offer good explanations? Almost any subject will do; I need more information on basically everything. The only two things I would like to put off to a later date are endgame (most of my games are not yet close enough to be decided in the endgame), and studying/cramming joseki (just not too interested in that at this point in time).

Thanks in advance

I do not recall if the Level Up books explain the why.

Before recommending you other books, please tell us in which ranking system you are 5 to 10 kyu.

Very little "why" in the Level Up books - mostly exercises but with hints like "Capture white by increasing your liberties" - which you then need to read out - So lots of neat exercises but very little theory present.

I've not read a lot of theory books (Attack & Defence really, and Lessons in the Fundamentals) - and I find the books very good at training pattern recognition for things that frequently crop up in my games. I've done a lot of pure life and death exercises and find that I have a much harder time reading out capturing races and cut-connect tesujis than I do those so I find the training very helpful. The books are not well suited if you want a thorough textual explanation of "why" though.

RobertJasiek wrote:I do not recall if the Level Up books explain the why.

Before recommending you other books, please tell us in which ranking system you are 5 to 10 kyu.

At this time of writing, I'm 11k on OGS (but have just started there; I've won and lost some games against players between 8k and 12k). On KGS I've hit 5k(?), but now I've dropped back to 9-10k again after my rank stabilized. According to Sensei's Library, 11k OGS would indeed be KGS 6k, if I can, at some point, actually stabilize at that level instead of bouncing around like a rubber ball.

Majordomo wrote:Very little "why" in the Level Up books - mostly exercises but with hints like "Capture white by increasing your liberties" - which you then need to read out - So lots of neat exercises but very little theory present.

I've not read a lot of theory books (Attack & Defence really, and Lessons in the Fundamentals) - and I find the books very good at training pattern recognition for things that frequently crop up in my games. I've done a lot of pure life and death exercises and find that I have a much harder time reading out capturing races and cut-connect tesujis than I do those so I find the training very helpful. The books are not well suited if you want a thorough textual explanation of "why" though.

Thanks for your feedback. At some point I'll probably look into the Elementary Go series and the other classics.

I've seen this book First Fundamentals, written by an author named Robert Jasiek (I've seen that name somewhere before.... ), of which it is said that it does explain principles thoroughly. Maybe I'll try that, as the PDF-version isn't expensive

The development of level up is so systematic that the "why" is obvious .. I am at level R2 ( so that is book 12 I guess ) and I would say it approaches somewhere btwn graded go problems 2 ( so progress is very slow ). That said what is great about this series is the systematic nature of the approach you can not help but recognize shapes through instinct. There are occasionally tricky problems, so the bar I set is to get a 90 / 100 % pass rate before moving on ( which serves to prevent my own sloppy thinking while reading ) I have heard the jump up level is a bit more advanced so there might be something to be said for starting there. ( I must admit I enjoyed the review and even the super cheesy cartoons etc with the earlier books and would say I found reviewing the basics useful)

There is another series like this that moves much faster and is sans cartoons etc. That is the speed Baduk series from oromedia . They are on sale now because the publisher went out of business but that means you are going to have to scrounge around a bit to find a complete set ( so go game guru has them super cheap but is missing 1-3)

To be honest I have found these books far more useful than the standard English books which don't have enough examples to move a concept into instinct and I wish there were more books in this style.

I agree - I'm also reading through R2 now, having finished R1 (I don't have the Level Up books, just the Jump ones and Review 1 and 2). It really hammers in common shapes and patterns in a systematic fashion.

Thanks all

As I'm already (still...) in the SDK range, I think I'm going to make a concerted effort to stabilize my rank/strength in the upper SDK range first (KGS 5k-1k), and then go from there. I'm thinking about getting these books, as they are series, but probably not all at once though

Learn how to play Go 1-5 (while 1 and 2 will probably not be of much use anymore I'm a completionist with book series...)
Jump Level Up 1-5 and the answer books (because they are 10k-1k systematic)
Elementary Go 1-7 (In the beginning... etc... because literally everybody recommends to read at least 1, 3 and 5)
Get strong at... (Seems you just must have that)

In addition, I'll also get "First Fundamentals" and "Fighting Fundamentals" (as PDF) by Robert, because I like the sample material. As noted by others in the threads about these books the English isn't always up to the standards of Shakespeare (mine isn't either ), I like what I see. He actually seems to, indeed, explain stuff.

I'll also have a look through this page:

Go books by difficulty

And then some problem books/programs of course... but as I said, not all at once.

Ahh I see, so the non-review level up's have enough "theory" to walk you through a series of available approaches for you get it and said theory is generalizable enough to try all the problems at hand. The R1 R2 review books are supposed to be just a problem book reviewing the level ups so the theory on why that approach works is a bit more missing w/ R2 (and R1). The genius of the level ups is with each section it covers something slightly new and then rereviews everything from 2-3 books behind it as you go, so you absolutely will not forget. It does this for L&D, opening moves (including one zillion off variations of Joseki, so while you end up memorizing the joseki, its an accident of the fact that you actually are memorizing the concepts behind them).

If I were to make an analogy, these korean book series turn go into basic elementary school math homework. If an algebra textbook was written by a theorist who presented each concept w/ 3 examples and then moved on to another concept, while none of us would argue the material isn't there, but at the same time we wouldn't be surprised that such an approach wouldn't really teach people algebra (its no accident daily homework is more akin to do all problems 1-50 odd, and do it over and over again until its instinct). I honestly find the classic english books (learning to play go, the kiseido serieses etc) more like the former and these books far more like the latter.

The concept is genius enough that I keep thinking of hunting down the original korean textbooks and bribing someone to translate them for me

The "Why" in the Level Up books is omitted, but 90% of the time the answer is "because this is the only move that kills White" or "because this is the only move that lets Black live".

For problems that are about shape or opening strategy, the lack of explanatory text is indeed a drawback. It would help to have a teacher (or helpful people on a forum) to explain answers if necessary.

That said, I love these books because they're so systematic and drill concepts so thoroughly. I picked up the "why" of some concepts better by being drilled in them in these books than by reading English explanations.

Note that the Jump Level Up books are not a complete curriculum and will not take you to 1k by themselves. They focus largely on life and death and tesuji (as they should, in my opinion).

Babelardus, at your current level, the most suitable books explaining the why and excluding joseki / endgame are in this order:

- First Fundamentals
- my next book hopefully appearing later this week
- If afterwards you still want to learn more about tactical reading, read Tactical Reading.
- Fighting Fundamentals. Although the book goes very much into the why, you are at the lower end of the intended readership and might still find the book a bit above your head. Either postpone it read it again later.

***

Other books? Not for your level (check again when you are a solid KGS 5k; in particular, I do not recommend yet for your level any Elementary Series book nor Fundamental Principles) or not explaining the why well enough. That said, you might nevertheless consider reading Lessons in the Fundamentals, Tesuji (Davies) and Opening Theory Made Easy (which I have not read but many find useful for roughly your level).

Thanks for all the input

I've just been looking at some of the stores. Go Shop Keima in the Netherlands seems to have a bazillion books in stock, in unbelievable quantities. Like... 50+ of many books. Of Elementary Go Series 6, Endgame, it has 480 (!) copies. Maybe people don't study endgame that much.

If you're right Robert, then there's not much to read if you're between KGS 5k and 10k...