Life In 19x19

Seriously, is it that hard to not require this horrible technology?

handa711 wrote:Seriously, is it that hard to not require this horrible technology?

Tygem, IGS, wbaduk...

I don't think it's that horrible though.

• Dragon Go Server (DGS) dragongoserver.net (correspondence games only)
• Online Go Server (OGS) online-go.com (live & correspondence games, server of my choice)

I guess you're talking about KGS. If you use Chrome as your browser you can use this:

viewtopic.php?f=24&t=13297

If you want to use the official Java client for KGS, you can also run it under Zulu which is based on OpenJDK and can be "installed" by simply extracting a zip-file so it won't pollute your system with automatic updaters, browser toolbars, adware or other rubbish: https://probabilism.wordpress.com/2016/ ... al-damage/

The Windows and Mac packages are already packaged to not need any special Java installs. The package just puts the JRE with the executable.

oren wrote:

handa711 wrote:Seriously, is it that hard to not require this horrible technology?

Tygem, IGS, wbaduk...

I don't think it's that horrible though.

It's a massive attack surface so unless you isolate it in someway (Charlie's suggestion is good) it's a bit of a headache.

A list of the Java vulnerabilities this year.
https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-93/product_id-19117/Oracle-JRE.html

Also KGS use an invalid SSL certificate (still, even though in 2016 you can get them for free) and you also need to whitelist IIRC even then.

Besides this, Apple have pretty much made it so that each version of Mac OS X KGS breaks without some manual work.

So yeah. It's horrible.

The only place I ever play is OGS at online-go.com. its a great server that requires nothing like that.

handa711 wrote:Seriously, is it that hard to not require this horrible technology?

What's wrong with Java? Why would you care about the technology as long as the product works?

Stefany93 wrote:
What's wrong with Java?

Here's a good place to start if you're curious.

Drew, please don't use an obfuscated url so I know where I would go if I click that link. Why do you want to use a short url if space is not limited (and you've given a long link text) and people aren't going to be typing it into their device from a poster?

Drew wrote:

Stefany93 wrote:
What's wrong with Java?

Here's a good place to start if you're curious.

Link please.

Drew wrote:

Stefany93 wrote:What's wrong with Java?

Here's a good place to start if you're curious.

Uberdude wrote:Drew, please don't use an obfuscated url so I know where I would go if I click that link. Why do you want to use a short url if space is not limited (and you've given a long link text) and people aren't going to be typing it into their device from a poster?

DrStraw wrote:Link please.

It was a joke, linking back to this: https://www.google.com/#q=what%27s+wrong+with+java

"Let Me Google That For You" is a very obnoxious way to answer a question. It isn't a joke and it isn't funny - it's arrogant and lazy and shows that you disdain to answer the question from your own perspective. That last point is a very good reason to simply hold your peace.

As a programmer, I'll step in and answer the original question from MY perspective: there's nothing truly wrong with Java as a language itself. All programming languages have their pros and cons and Java is no different - it is a mature, well thought out Object Oriented programming language. The problems start when you look at the way Java is realised.

• Java programmes require you to install a runtime environment in order to run them. This runtime environment is bundled with stuff that "phones home", automatic update services and, in the past, with blatant malware in the form of the Ask Toolbar.
• Java's RE is also bundled with a browser plugin that is installed in nearly all Web Browser software.
• Java's RE and associated Browser plugin are flawed - having them installed on your system and in your browser opens you up to malicious attacks because of flaws in the implementation. Oracle's ones are closed-source so these flaws can not be fixed or easily discovered by anyone but Oracle.
• Java's license terms are obscure and incredibly vague, filled with traps that lawyers can exploit to extort money from successful users (programmers) of Java whenever Larry wants a new boat.
• Java's developer tools and artefacts are freely distributed but that distribution also includes several things that are not free to use. No barriers present you from using them and you'll get away with it until the lawyers take another turn, by which time you might have inadvertently and unknowingly sold your soul to Oracle.

Well said.