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 Post subject: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #1 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:57 am 
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Rank: OGS 14kyu
OGS: 14 kyu
After being introduced to Go about 10 years ago, it took me 8 years to really start giving Go a go *badumdumtss*. Sadly my interest in the game faded quickly, mainly due to the time it consumes. Fast-forward to 2 months ago, here I was again aiming for the alluring "dan" rank. I realize that my quest will be hard, even frustating at times. However in the end I expect it to also be rewarding giving me a sense purpose, something to aim for. My ultimate goal is to participate in the National Championship 2 years from now as a "dan" level player. My short-term goal is to become a SDK. Currently I hover around 17-15 kyu on OGS. This journal will serve as my own personal reflection space. If anyone is interested in following my journey, I gladly welcome him or her to do so. If you have any tips/tricks/feedback to help me improve, please feel free to comment.

As for my personal life. I'm 29 years old, working as a data-analyst for the dutch government(~ 4 years work experience). Also very close to becoming a father for the first time (this week!).

Current rank: 15 kyu (OGS)
Current goal: 9 kyu (OGS) by 31-12-2018
Currently reading: Attack and Defense

Theme of the week:
The quest for my own Go-style


Last edited by rikuge on Wed Sep 12, 2018 3:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post #2 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 3:01 am 
Honinbo
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Hi rikuge,

Welcome, and good luck. Congrats! :)


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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #3 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:03 am 
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rikuge wrote:
As for my personal life. I'm 29 years old, working as a data-analyst for the dutch government(~ 4 years work experience). Also very close to becoming a father for the first time (this week!).


Hmm, and picking up go again ... Any sacrifices?

rikuge wrote:
Currently reading: Attack and Defense


Good choice.

rikuge wrote:
Theme of the week:
The quest for my own Go-style


Your style is like the rest of ours: amateurish. And it will remain so when you have reached your goal. I'd choose a different theme. :)

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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #4 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:24 am 
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Good luck, rikuge!

I admire your objective of playing in a tournament 2 years from now as a Dan player. I do hope, however, that it won't lead to frustration IF reality would turn out differently. I'm not saying you can't do it, I certainly have no idea, but I have personal experience of putting too much pressure on myself and I can only say it's not worth it :)
That said, it's healthy to want to improve and to have something to work for. I would be lying if I said I didn't want to become a Dan player one day, and that I'm not working towards that.

Knotwilg wrote:
rikuge wrote:
Theme of the week:
The quest for my own Go-style

Your style is like the rest of ours: amateurish. And it will remain so when you have reached your goal. I'd choose a different theme. :)


While you are probably right, and I've heard this said before, I don't quite agree with this.
I feel even amateur/low/... players can have their own style of playing. Some naturally play for influence, some are very fight-oriented, some are actually very flexibel and will play to match their opponent. Some make the game more complex and profit from that, while others play simple but solidly...
Obviously it's not good to pin down on a certain style as an amateur (or ever), you should always experiment, try out new things, look at the situation and handle it as required. But I feel style can be applied on other levels than the professionals' as well.
I feel it's unfair to take style away from us just because we're not professional :D

Compare it to this: I am definitely not a professional guitar player, far from it. Yet in my amateur ways, I have a certain style of playing. A friend of mine is another guitar player, with a whole other style. Even though we're both amateurs, you can see (or rather, hear) the difference well enough.

I believe that also goes for Go.
Perhaps I am mistaken completely. Or perhaps I have a different definition of the word "style".

Or maybe style at a low level is only a way to tell what weaknesses are in our play... (my style is solid -> don't play fast enough. my style is peaceful -> you can't fight well enough. I am a territorial player -> you don't know how to use influence)

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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #5 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:24 am 
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Good luck on your goal. I look forward to hearing about your success.

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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #6 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:40 am 
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Thanks for all the support :).

Knotwilg wrote:
rikuge wrote:
Theme of the week:
The quest for my own Go-style

Your style is like the rest of ours: amateurish. And it will remain so when you have reached your goal. I'd choose a different theme. :)

I like the way how Ian Butler phrases it. Maybe I should rephrase it a little. How about: Figuring out what my preferred style of playing is (to be more aware of my weaknesses).

Knotwilg wrote:
rikuge wrote:
As for my personal life. I'm 29 years old, working as a data-analyst for the dutch government(~ 4 years work experience). Also very close to becoming a father for the first time (this week!).
Knotwilg wrote:
Hmm, and picking up go again ... Any sacrifices?

Different life stage. I experienced a lot of stress at my previous job, didn't have the patience to truly give a go a shot. Can't guarantee that it will stick this time, however I feel confident that I can truly progress and enjoy the game this time around. Also, due to becoming a parent real soon, I will be forced to spend more time at home, giving me the opportunity to study Go more.

Ian Butler wrote:
I admire your objective of playing in a tournament 2 years from now as a Dan player. I do hope, however, that it won't lead to frustration IF reality would turn out differently. I'm not saying you can't do it, I certainly have no idea, but I have personal experience of putting too much pressure on myself and I can only say it's not worth it :) That said, it's healthy to want to improve and to have something to work for. I would be lying if I said I didn't want to become a Dan player one day, and that I'm not working towards that.

This is a valid point, will definitely keep this in the back of mind. I think that i'll set up some checkpoints along the way, where I will assess what is a viable goal in the immediate future. For now however i'll keep the goal as it is.

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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #7 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:09 am 
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First game, First loss

And so it begins. After a relatively good start I think I messed up at move 24. It felt like I had to choose between blocking at G9 and H8. In retrospect I feel as if H8 would have a better move. After this move I never felt that I stood a chance. In regards to my earlier comment about 'playing-style', I feel as if I play too passively, avoiding fights where I can and having the tendency to overdefend. This is also something I do in real life, in a sense Go is also a reflection on life I guess ;).

With move 56 I tried to build up some influence on the right side, however i feel as if move 58 should have been in the other direction (O14 for example).

Well that was a rocky start, back to reading :).


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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #8 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 1:22 pm 
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You let your opponent make 2 shimaris+ extension along the side + the two other corners, that's a bit too much...

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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #9 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 1:26 pm 
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Yeah, i guess i'm a bit too focused on playing the moves I want, while i should respond properly..

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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #10 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 1:29 pm 
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rikuge wrote:
Also, due to becoming a parent real soon, I will be forced to spend more time at home, giving me the opportunity to study Go more.


Hm, it's not easy to concentrate on anything at home when young children are around...

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Post #11 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 3:08 pm 
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Hi rikuge,

:w10: Someone with a nice bot can check this position:
seems OK for :white: .

:w22: B is basically alive (with (B11 & A11) or (B11 & A10 tiger's mouth), etc.)
So B is not really a target. Check with a bot about :w22: .

:w24:
Quote:
It felt like I had to choose between blocking at G9 and H8.
Locally :white: G9 is bad shape for W. Blocking at H8 is better. But check with a bot. Re: Toothpaste and SmallGaps

:b25: Locally this is terrible shape for White. If you have no feeling why this is bad (thus you felt G9 and H8 were potential candidates), you need to develop an understanding why this local shape is terrible for W:
This and other terrible local shapes are common at DDK levels.
( But as always, there are exceptions; also check with a bot. )
Re: Toothpaste and SmallGaps

:w24:, :b25:, :w26: Re: Toothpaste and SmallGaps

:w28: B has B5 follow-up.

:b29: Mistake. B's local follow-up is B5.

:w30: Missed. Can you find the correct punishment for :b29: ?
Study :w30: dropping at B5.
:b33: Too small, globally.

:w34: Replying locally is globally too small.

:w34:, :b35: What if :b35: atari at D2 ? (Did you read :b35: atari D2? )

:w36: Too small, globally.

:b37: Very big. ( :w34: at C17 very big for White. )

:b47: Mistake, globally. B should tenuki (check with a bot).

:w50: Mistake, globally. W should tenuki (check with a bot).
( Locally, it's still a mistake. Locally, C14 tiger's mouth is better --
study the local endgame sequence when :black: hanes A15. )

:b51:, :w52:, :b53:, :w54: All wrong. All too small, globally. Both sides should tenuki on each of these moves. Both sides miss the global picture, and both sides suffer from follow-itis -- blindly following your opponent (re: :b33:, :w34:, :w36: ).
Quote:
With move 56 I tried to build... 58...O14 for example
No. :w56: and :w58: (either way) accomplish little, and are inefficient. Check with a bot. ( With :black: H8 and :black: o16, your center is not big at all. )

:b59: B can just turn at H9.

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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #12 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 4:56 pm 
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jlt wrote:
rikuge wrote:
Also, due to becoming a parent real soon, I will be forced to spend more time at home, giving me the opportunity to study Go more.


Hm, it's not easy to concentrate on anything at home when young children are around...


There's a Korean saying something to the effect that a go player won't notice if the house is burning down while he's playing a game.

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Post #13 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:08 pm 
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Quote:
There's a Korean saying something to the effect that a go player won't notice if the house is burning down while he's playing a game.
A Chinese version is the two men who started a game and didn't notice when they finished, a thousand years had passed.
( or was it 100 ? )

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Post #14 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:46 pm 
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EdLee wrote:
:w10: Someone with a nice bot can check this position:
seems OK for :white: .


My bot is not very nice (only Leela 0.11.0). LeelaZero might have a different opinion but this should be enough for a 15 kyu game. My bot thinks that position :w10: is balanced (W+1). The game starts to be markedly in favor of Black after the second corner invasion (B+15 after :b50:, B+21 after :w51:).

Anyway, as you say position :w10: is OK for :white: but probably :white: needs to learn to invade if he wants to let :black: build frameworks like that.

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Post #15 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:13 pm 
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Hi jlt,

Thanks.
Your bot is nice: (1) it's superhuman and (2) you have a bot. :salute:

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Post #16 Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:54 pm 
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EdLee wrote:
Hi jlt,

Thanks.
Your bot is nice: (1) it's superhuman and (2) you have a bot. :salute:


Leela 0.11.0 is not superhuman, "just" middle/high amateur dan.

For what it's worth, LZ #175 think it's ok for white. A little suboptimal (after :w10:, white is at 52%, down from 53.6% on an empty board), but it doesn't really matter.

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Post #17 Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:41 am 
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Quote:
Leela 0.11.0 is not superhuman, "just" middle/high amateur dan.
Oh! :)
Quote:
it doesn't really matter.
Correct.

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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #18 Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2018 8:34 pm 
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Thanks for all the feedback. My son was born yesterday so my quest was halted for a few days. Will review soon :).


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Post #19 Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:10 pm 
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Congrats! :)

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 Post subject: Re: A dive into the wondrous world of Go
Post #20 Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:27 am 
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After a one week hiatus. I'm back in business. Thanks for the game review and comments! Put my play into perspective.

Taking one step back in order to move two steps up

After playing a few games feeling underwhelmed with my own play I felt that I needed to take a step back and look back at the fundamentals. Looking back on reading 'Attack and Defense' I realize that I could not grasp some of the concepts presented in the book due to my lack of understanding of important concepts. Currently I'm solely solving Tsumego and reading 'Lessons in the Fundamentals of Go'. This is also kind of a necessity since my newborn needs a lot of attention, which limits my opportunity to play for 1 hour straight.

I feel that if I improve my basics a bit more, it'll jump start my progress in the coming weeks. Even if this is not the case I still enjoy learning about Go concepts.

Current rank: 15 kyu (OGS)
Current goal: 9 kyu (OGS) by 31-12-2018
Currently reading: Lessons in the Fundamentals of Go

Theme of the week:
Back to the fundamentals

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